David Frum poses for a portrait

As a speechwriter for George W. Bush, David Frum helped coin the term “axis of evil.” Leading up to the 2016 election, Frum railed against the Republican party for failing to modernize and for ignoring problems like inequality and climate change. In his new book “Trumpocracy,” Frum focuses on the structural problems that allowed Trump to win, the danger he poses to democracy and how to remedy the situation. Frum joins us to discuss his book and the political news of the day.

Conservative David Frum on Escaping a Trump ‘Dead End’ 5 February,2018Michael Krasny

Guests:
David Frum, senior editor, The Atlantic; author, "Trumpocracy: The Corruption of The American Republic"; former speechwriter for President George W. Bush

  • Curious

    Frum is not a conservative and has admitted as much. He is a lackey the left calls on to pretend they are balanced. Please do not insult our intelligence.

    • Noelle

      He’s a Canadian conservative who moved here so he’s a naturalized American but anyway, not typical conservative, not a populist one.

      • Curious

        He has publicly stated he is not a conservative. Those are the only ones ever allowed on the MSM.

        • William – SF

          Nonsense. Paul Ryan, as one example, has been on NPR and Forum. In Ryan’s case he was peddling his nonsensical and fantastical agenda.

        • WBryanH

          Curious, you say Frum “He has publicly stated he is not a conservative.

          Oh really? Got a link for that his assertion you claim?

          Check out Frum profile from his website davidfrum dot com
          “…served as chairman of the board of trustees of the leading UK center-right think tank…”
          “…he served as speechwriter and special assistant to President George W. Bush…”
          “…in 2007-2008, as senior adviser to the Rudy Giuliani presidential campaigns…”

          Hmm. Who wouldn’t call this conservative?

          • Curious

            “on the issues that today most passionately divide Americans – healthcare reform, monetary policy, social spending to aid the unemployed, and – soon – the American response to the euro crisis, I have to recognize that my views are not very representative of the conservative mainstream.”

            David Frum

          • WBryanH

            And then there’s this from the same site:

            “…So long as the topic is “green jobs” or NLRB regulations or immigration, my thinking aligns reasonably congruently with the current conservative consensus…”

    • WBryanH

      Curious, in your opinion, who are the true conservative intellectuals? Thanks

  • Vern

    Life is too sort for fake conservatives like Mr Frum and fake liberals like NPR, or for that matter the new equivalent of lying Fox News which is called MSNBC. These are all globalists who act on behalf of the corporate occupation of America. They are members of a hate group called Wall street.

    • William – SF

      While your life grew shorter, DJT and Republicans gave $1.5 trillion of American largess from the U.S. Treasury to the wealthy and highly profitable corporations, and left you with the bill.

      Republican House Speaker Paul Ryan was so proud of their work he bragged about giving average working Americans $1.50 more money per week. Let Them Eat French Fries https://www.nytimes.com/2018/02/04/opinion/let-them-eat-french-fries.html

      • Noelle

        Maybe they should donate that extra $ per week to their local public radio station.

        • Curious

          I already am forced to “donate” for this left wing propaganda.

          • chriswinter

            Forced, eh? It must have been Diane Feinstein using voice on you. (She’s Bene Jesserit.)

            First . . . donate . . . to . . . N P R…” /s

          • Curious

            I pay taxes – as opposed to 50% of workers.

          • WBryanH

            *SMH* Just about everybody pays taxes.
            Walk into a store in nearly any state, buy a non-food item, you pay taxes on it.

          • Curious

            Only 50% of us pay federal taxes. And public broadcasting gets about half a billion dollars a year of federal funds.

      • Robert Thomas

        ‘Paul’; ‘Frank’; ‘Terry’…

      • Churbles

        And how insolvent is california becoming, sanctuary state now realizes it cannot afford universal healthcare. The clue should have been that you can’t even afford to home the homeless you already have littering your streets. So its quite the hypocrisy listening to people in San Fran complaining about largess to the wealthy when its a city filled with yuppies.
        But this shouldn’t be a surprise, because you aren’t left wing, the left are fakes as stated. Alternative Hypothesis on youtube has a video “you aren’t left wing” which lays it out plain, you will destroy every value on the alter of diversity, on the outsider. You see this in Sweden, once your socialist fantasy, the example, the goal, and now their social fabric is in tatters and their long term demographic and economic viability is questionable, all sacrificed on the alter of “diversity”.
        The left has proven itself as the path to ruin, all other considerations are simply minor considerations at this point.
        When feminists find common cause with Islam, it should be the clue, all useful sheep for the globalists to rule.

        • William – SF

          “Altar” …If you consider yourself a Christian you might want to take note.

          California is doing quite well. Your arguments, not so much. Maybe you’re thinking of what Republicans did to Kansas and DJT and Republicans are now doing to the U.S.

    • WBryanH

      Vern, who do you think are real conservatives and real liberals? Who do you think produces “real” news? Thanks.

  • Skip Conrad

    Maybe our system is working the way it’s supposed. It sure has helped uncover corruption in the democrats. The FISA memo supports the notion that Trump was not lying when he stated Trump Tower was bugged.

  • jakeleone

    Hillary would be President if Obama hadn’t stopped trying to help the economy recover from the recession. Our government programs and treaties were geared toward moving jobs out of the country, at a time when we needed those jobs the most. For example: half the H-1b visas go to Offshore Outsourcing companies. The upcoming climate change agreement gave a free pass to India and China for the next 15 years. Cap and trade insanely handicaps the U.S. as an investment location. On and on, insane programs that gave away jobs.

    Who needs Russians when you have programs likes these?

    Why can’t Democrats get it right?

    • Noelle

      read this report

      https://www.ineteconomics.org/perspectives/blog/how-money-won-trump-the-white-house

      very long and detailed but important and eye-opening.

      • jakeleone

        Have to agree money is critical to a campaign, how and when it is spend also important. But on that Hillary barely lost, 2-3 states where Trump won by a few thousand votes, and Hillary would have been President The truth is if the Democrats had been more pro-active on the economy and not on World-Legacy we would be seeing a different President.

  • William – SF

    The party holding all the political power in Washington is attempting to delegitimize an ongoing investigation that has uncovered malfeasances in their political party. At what point will DJT and Republicans in Congress adhere to their oath of office to preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States? They are attempting to end the investigation before its completed.

    What are they conspiring to hide from the American people?

    • Curious

      We know that the investigation is based on false accusations bought from the Russians by Hillary.

      • WBryanH

        What false accusations?

        • Curious

          The Steele Dossier.

          • WBryanH

            And where’s your proof those accusations are false?

          • Curious

            Well, Comey stated they were. And no one disputes they are.

          • WBryanH

            Links please. Citations please.

          • Julia

            He’s a troll, always on Forum.

          • WBryanH

            Julia, I agree. And I’ll wager at least a few of these commenters are paid.

          • Curious

            Then-FBI Director James Comey knew that a critical piece of information relating to the investigation into Hillary Clinton’s email was fake — created by Russian intelligence — but he feared that if it became public it would undermine the probe and the Justice Department itself, according to multiple officials with knowledge of the process.

            The Washington Post reported Wednesday that this Russian intelligence was unreliable. US officials now tell CNN that Comey and FBI officials actually knew early on that this intelligence was indeed false.

            In fact, acting FBI Director Andrew McCabe went to Capitol Hill Thursday to push back on the notion that the FBI was duped, according to a source familiar with a meeting McCabe had with members of the Senate intelligence committee.

            https://www.cnn.com/2017/05/26/politics/james-comey-fbi-investigation-fake-russian-intelligence/index.html

          • WBryanH

            “Curious” your definitive statement & my response:

            “…the Christopher Steele dossier was bought and paid for by the Clinton Campaign and the DNC,…”

            Yes, “Curious” the Dems picked it up after the *conservative* site The Washington Free Beacon, during the GOP primaries first contracted with Fusion GPS to initiate what was to become the Steele dossier.

            Bottom line: The Steele dossier is a *bipartisan effort*

            “Curious” as for the rest of your comment? Let’s give all your conditionals “…dossier itself *may* have been…*apparently* used…” the weight they deserve. They *may* be worthy of consideration. But they are NOT fact. At this time, they are conjecture

            And your wholly unsupported *personal* conclusions “…I concluded …it was a fake…There is no way that Steele’s alleged top-level Kremlin informants would spill…Steele’s informants were therefore either fictitious, or low-level poseurs…Persistent media efforts to validate the Steele dossier have failed…”

            Again “Curious,” you and I don’t know all that Mueller & Co knows. Indeed you and I and and the media likely know merely a small fraction what the Mueller knows. So, again, all what you claim in your comment is only conjecture. You may fervently *believe* your personal conclusions. But please understand that, at this point, they are only conjecture.

          • Curious

            “Yes, “Curious” the Dems picked it up after the *conservative* site The Washington Free Beacon, during the GOP primaries first contracted with Fusion GPS to initiate what was to become the Steele dossier.

            Bottom line: The Steele dossier is a *bipartisan effort*”

            False.

            During the Republican primaries, a research firm called Fusion GPS was hired by The Washington Free Beacon, a conservative website, to unearth potentially damaging information about Mr. Trump. The Free Beacon — which was funded by a major donor supporting Mr. Trump’s rival for the party’s nomination, Senator Marco Rubio of Florida — told Fusion GPS to stop doing research on Mr. Trump in May 2016, as Mr. Trump was clinching the Republican nomination.

            After Mr. Trump secured the nomination, Fusion GPS was hired on behalf of Mrs. Clinton’s campaign and the D.N.C. by their law firm, Perkins Coie, to compile research about Mr. Trump, his businesses and associates — including possible connections with Russia. It was at that point that Fusion GPS hired Mr. Steele, who has deep sourcing in Russia, to gather information.
            https://www.nytimes.com/2017/10/25/us/politics/steele-dossier-trump-expained.html

          • WBryanH

            *LAUGH*

            Curious, you just *proved* my comment: That the Steele dossier is indeed a *bipartisan effort*

            Curious you give this above: “…During the Republican primaries, a research firm called Fusion GPS was hired by The Washington Free Beacon, a conservative website, to unearth potentially damaging information about Mr. Trump…”

            Curious, in that your quoted comment, please see where it says: “…Washington Free Beacon, a *conservative* website…” The Beacon engaged Fusion GPS to gather dope on Trump to try to discredit him to allow one of the other GOP candidates to win the GOP primary.

            “Curious.” The operative string here is “GOP.”

            A *GOP* proxy initiated what became the Steele dossier. Then, when it became clear Trump will get the nod, the Dems picked it up.

            I.e *both* parties funded the Steele dossier.

            “Curious.” When you have both parties contributed to develop a project, that’s called a *bipartisan* effort.

            Any questions?

          • Churbles

            Yea no, he laid out the actual time line and you are taking the absurd interpretation to get off on your degenerate liberal fan fiction, which was as usual more revealing about the lefts psychology than anything else.
            You can’t keep two thoughts in your head straight at the same time. Its no surprise your ilk are now feeling the burn of the false accusation witch hunt storm of #metoo, now burned by your own game. After the election most every hate crime was a hoax, how many hijab pulls are we at, all you can do is fabricate and fantasize, and prove to the rest of us that we made the right choice, you’ve become unfit to lead.
            I mean seriously, your entire russia bot scandal hinges upon foreign influencing being an act of war upon our country, which if taken to the logical conclusion would make your censorious liberal friends who run those platforms guilty of treason for attempting to manipulate our elections.

          • WBryanH

            Uh, sure, “Churbles.” How you feel etc.
            Curious how you chose your handle.
            It is a portmanteau of “churlish burbles?”

          • WBryanH

            Dear “Churbles.” (Rhymes with “gerbils?”)
            You give us high-flown words, thrown into a tossed salad. With zero evidence to give them any bite.
            Thanks for playing Churbles. But no soup for you!
            NEXT…

          • Curious

            BTW, you need to do your own research from now on. It is not my job to educate you.

          • WBryanH

            Um, it’s YOUR job to back up your assertions

          • WBryanH

            Curious, YOU make the claim, then YOU must back it up.
            That is, unless you don’t care if we take you seriously or not. Your choice.

          • Curious

            I don’t care what you think. You’re job should be to get educated and not display your ignorance.

          • WBryanH

            Yes, Curious. How you feel etc. Now you’re moving on to the personal attacks right on cue. How drearily predictable.

          • Another Mike

            No one has to prove that accusations are false, The accuser has to prove them true, beyond a reasonable doubt. in this country. Innocent until proven guilty.

            What country are you posting from?

          • WBryanH

            “Another Mike,” the person who makes the claims must furnish the proof for those claims, if they want to be taken at all seriously.
            “Curious” made unsubstantiated charges about the Steele dossier. He must substantiate his charges if he wants to be taken seriously. Otherwise he(she?) is just spouting personal opinion based on who-knows-what.

      • William – SF

        Michael Flynn, Paul Manafort, and Carter Page, all participants in DJT’s campaign are feeling like the investigation is real.

        • Curious

          All process crimes or actions unrelated to Trump and his campaign.

          • William – SF

            You don’t know that because the investigation isn’t complete.

          • Curious

            We know what we know.

          • William – SF

            And what you don’t know is what? …it’s not known.

          • Curious

            We know what Flynn and Manafort have been charged with – nothing related to collusion.

          • William – SF

            Again, based on an incomplete investigation, and narrowly disclosed information.

          • Robert Thomas

            Man, it’s those unknown unknowns that trip up the unwary, for sure.

          • WBryanH

            lol

        • Curious

          I urge you to read this article and those linked in it. Andrew McCarthy is a very smart guy and straight shooter.

          http://www.nationalreview.com/article/456079/republican-house-releases-fisa-memo-confirms-steele-dossier-suspicions

          • William – SF

            Okay, I read it. With incomplete information it only leaves me with more questions that can only start to be answered after the investigation is completed.

            Here’s one for you. Devin Nune’s Nothingburger https://www.nytimes.com/2018/02/02/opinion/devin-nunes-memo.html

          • Curious

            Well, we know the NYT has an agenda and are not overly concerned with facts. In the article they try and finesse the dossier. The FBI knew that the information in the dossier was bought and paid for by Clinton but hid that fact from the court. Why?

          • William – SF

            We can be honest with one another and recognize the degree to which bias can be found in both the NYT and the National Review, and how their biases may differ from other media sources, both for better and for worse.

            I’ll assume neither of us is devoted to one “voice” for our information while acknowledging that we have our biases and lean to voices we more identify with than those we don’t.

            And I’m still back to expecting a full and complete investigation before judgment can be made.

    • Another Mike

      The Democrats hold the balance of power in the Senate because they can block any bill they like via filibuster.

      As far as malfeasances in their political party, I am shocked that Obama named a lowlife like General Flynn assistant director of national intelligence in the Office of the Director of National Intelligence, and later head of the Defense Intelligence Agency. I mean, didn’t Obama vet him sufficiently?

  • Noelle

    Has he read Thomas Ferguson’s analysis of 2016 election? Money has distorted our political system, as well as the economic shifts which are creating real economic pain for most Americans. Enough voters were desperate enough to believe DJT would help.

    https://www.ineteconomics.org/perspectives/blog/how-money-won-trump-the-white-house

  • Another Mike

    If the FBI had Carter Page under surveillance since 2013, why did they not apply for a FISA warrant for him until October, 2016, when the FBI had the Steele dossier in hand, and even included it in their FISA warrant application? This sounds awfully like the Steele dossier was essential to the FISA warrant application.

    And speaking of the Steele dossier: Did Donald Trump really pay Russian prostitutes to urinate for him, as the Steele dossier asserts?

    • Curious

      The fake dossier was absolutely essential to the warrant. that is a simple fact.

    • jakeleone

      That dossier was used in a covert way, they didn’t disclose the source was the democratic committee. I heard a Senator justify this as being a case they didn’t want to just go around unmasking everyone. Then the show host quickly pointer out apparently the FBI unmasks if it is a Republican, we keep it quiet if the information comes from a Democratic source. It really looks bad and it looks like FBI agents just didn’t want Trump in and they felt pursuing this case, with all the methods available to a strategic investigator, would be give them a gold-star.

      So they did everything to get that FISA warrant. They spied on Trump officials. Got those Trump officials in for an interview, and if they weren’t truthful or just plain forgot that they met with a Russian official and didn’t say the same to the FBI during their interview.

      It was cause to bring charge them with something, and they charged people with anything they could find.

      Same FBI, has ample evidence that Hillary Clinton crudely destroyed evidence (Hard Drives with a hammer), on an insecure private Email server that she illegally used to send around Top-Secret documents. A Federal Offense that will get you 10+ years.

      That same FBI wouldn’t prosecute Hillary Clinton.

      Tells you everything you need to know about justice in the U.S. today.

  • William – SF

    Mr Frum, what is the future of the Republican Party?

    Once the Republican Party’s aging white male constituency has aged itself into their graves, and right-wing conservative media has buried themselves in their gaudy gilded coffins, and Fox News has disappeared from the airwaves, what will your party look like?

    • Noelle

      Maybe he wants the country club Repubs like Mitt Romney to take back control.

    • Curious

      How would he know?

      • William – SF

        What do you think it is?

        • Curious

          No idea. He has publicly stated he is not a conservative.

          • WBryanH

            Yeah, Curious, until you can actually furnish a source for your claim, we’ll have to say NO, Frum never said he was “not a conservative.” Thanks.

          • Curious

            Why the use of the royal “we”?

          • WBryanH

            OK, I changed it to “I”.

  • Noelle

    Interesting that #releasethememo was retweeted by bots as well as real people…maybe not as many people care as Twitter seems to show.

  • Ben Rawner

    Does your guest hold himself personally responsible for the current administration and new leaning of the Republican Party? This hyper partisanship started under Bush Jr. administration and their close ties to Fox News, which is basically the propaganda arm of the Republican Party.

    • William – SF

      Newt Gingrich broke many barriers of civility while in office.

    • Curious

      The MSM and NPR are part of the DNC.

      • William – SF

        Got an org chart to share?

  • Kim Ladin

    Question for Mr. Frum:
    I’m having trouble understanding Paul Ryan’s role in all of this. I honestly thought Ryan was a person of principle, and could be counted on to stand up to Trump’s authoritarian and kleptocratic impulses. But he seems to have completely folded, especially in relation to Nunes’ shenanigans on the Intel Committee. Do you think it’s the case that Ryan sees his legislative agenda of dismantling the social safety net and de-funding the federal government as actually more important than the underlying rule of law and structure of American Constitutional democracy? And more broadly, is that why the GOP leadership and donor base all seem to be folding to Trump?

    • Noelle

      during 2016 election, many corporations were swayed that DJT would help their bottom line and they started (not very overtly) supporting him and donating to the campaign, especially the Mercers, Adelson etc
      Yes, Ryan wants his dream of dismantling the safety net to go through no matter what.

    • William – SF

      Paul Ryan is bought and paid-for by extremely right-wing conservative donors. Paul Ryan bragged (tweeted and then deleted) about giving average American workers $1.50 more a week while the wealthy and corporations with historically high profits got the lion’s share of their recent $1.5 trillion tax cut.

      $1.50 a week … to average American workers with annual incomes of ~$50,000.

      • Curious

        Michelle Obama complained of having to pay $50k a year on her kids piano and dance lessons – to women whose families earn less than $40 a year.

  • Another Mike

    Interesting that Mr. Frum omitted the first Presidential candidate to release his tax returns, the far from unimpeachable Richard Milhouse Nixon.

    • Noelle

      almost impeached.

    • WBryanH

      Maybe so. But Nixon wasn’t laundering millions of dollars of Russian oligarch/mafiya money

      • Curious

        Like Hillary?

        • WBryanH

          Your proof?

      • Another Mike

        Releasing tax returns proves nothing about the ethics of the candidate. Was Mitt a crook until he released his returns?

        • WBryanH

          “Another Mike,” unless someone actually gave you access to all of Trump’s tax returns, you have no idea whether or not they will lead to conclusive evidence that Trump engaged in criminal behavior.
          Please don’t try to do Mueller’s job. Thanks.

          • Another Mike

            Mueller’s job is a witch hunt, having nothing to do with investigating co=operatin between Trump and supposed Russian campaign activities on Trump’s behalf?

            Good to know. And glad to see a progressive admit it.

          • WBryanH

            Who is admitting what?
            And where’s your proof that Mueller’s investigation is a “witch hunt?”
            Thanks in advance for your proof for your claims.

  • trite

    The Presidency by its nature is weak as anyone with the money and fame can hijack it and become essentially a king or queen; the courts are weak as they are political institutions–judges nominated and approved by politicians; Congress is weak as it is bloated with money from contributors and subject to lobbyists. And the press is under constant threat. Maybe we need to look at the structure of the whole system.

    • Noelle

      Yes!

    • Curious

      Yep. Barry.

  • pm05

    So, Mr Frum is one of the people, ie Paul Ryan, who brags that a secretary got $1.50 per week bump; while Ryan, from some calculations got more than $5-6000 – a WEEK!
    He is okay with that?

  • Curious

    The left wing hysteria would be amusing if it wasn’t so damaging.

    • William – SF

      Delegitimizing an ongoing investigation, ignoring the rule-of-law, delegitimizing the opposition party are damaging.

      • Curious

        And that is exactly what the Obama regime did as we are now seeing.

        • William – SF

          Nonsense. Presented with credible evidence from intelligence agencies that the Russians were involving themselves in the 2016 Presidential election, presented with credible evidence that Michael Flynn was compromised by the Russians, the Obama administration chose to protect the American people and help the Republican candidate from making a disastrous campaign staff choice for a significant position.

        • WBryanH

          Curious, is it too much to ask you to provide even a shred of evidence for the wild claims you make?
          Thanks for considering.

      • Another Mike

        And delegitimizing a sitting President, in today’s world of terror, is just jim-dandy? Trump didn’t start this.

  • Noelle

    Yes, the Wall being built just makes some people feel better, despite most immigrants overstaying visas, entering through airports, etc

    • concerneth

      It is not most – according to the guest it is 25-40%. The wall is one part of immigration enforcement.

      If you don’t like immigration law then have them changed. You can’t pick and choose which laws to follow and be upset by the consequences of being caught.

      Tell me a first world nation or any nation for that matter where you are free to enter or leave without papers. Or that you won’t face possible deportation if you are caught as an illegal alien.

      The EU existed in part to remove restrictions and complications of member states to facilitate more free movement and commerce. In that sense the EU acts similar to interstate relation in USA.

      The DACA folks are in some ways victims of the illegal activity of their gaurdians. You can debate if those actions are right or wrong but you can’t debate their legality. If you think they are morally right for coming here illegally then try to change the law.

      I have not heard 1 Democrat suggest changing immigration law. They want to enforce it when they see fit. They have no plan to prevent illegal immigration or to stop another generation from being put in the same situation as the current DACA folks.

      I understand if you do not like the posturing of blaming Americas problems on illegal immigrants. I don’t think that illegal immigration is even in the top 10 of USA worst problems.

      But it is a broken system. And it is not possible to have a welfare state or universal healthcare in a country that does not have immigration restrictions.

      Will the wall fix the entire problem? No. Will it make some forms of illegal entrance much more difficult? Yes. If you don’t like the idea of having a walled in country I can appreciate that. But what solution do you propose?

      You do a disservice to the discussion by implying that people are idiots who want the wall because it makes them feel good. I can just as easily say people don’t want the wall because it makes them feel bad.

      • Noelle

        I agree that the immigration system is broken. so why has it been so hard to get the politicians to fix it? Maybe too many competing interests on all sides are battling so the politicians are prone to kicking the can down the road?

        • concerneth

          Well I agree its also a broken political system. Everyone thinks they should have it all, no compromises. It seems Trump is offerring amnesty fir DACA in exchange for the wall and other immigration reform. It seems a reasonable deal to me. Putting aside one’s personal feelings of Trump, is this not a fair deal? Your thoughts?

          As Grand Moff Tarken says to Darth Vader in Star Wars IV : “this bickering is pointless”.

          • Noelle

            yes. One thing I don’t like about the wall is the wildlife who don’t care what side of the border they are on getting blocked from migrating. Also, there are still lawsuits going on with landowners in Texas who sued during the last manifestation of wall building.

    • Another Mike

      It’s at most 40% visa overstays.

  • Noelle

    Our economic system is changing from industrial to something worse in that only some people can succeed using the traditional way to get ahead(college education, networking connections) with more and more people left to scramble in the gig economy.

  • Noelle

    The problem with him saying political competition over which are the better ideas is that he is not talking about our system captured by big money interests.

  • EIDALM

    David Ferum is a chameleon and weasel, not a conservative, he is a warmonger Neoconservative, PENACER, with the rest of the rest of them initiated the invasion of Iraq based on lies that destroyed near the whole middle and created the bloody terrorists, as well innitited the conflict in North Korea when he called as Axis of Evil.

  • Robert Thomas

    The caller is right and Frum, as usual, is wrong.

    DJT is effluvia from the alimentary canals of such as the Taft family, Barry Goldwater, Richard Nixon, Ronald Reagan, Newt Gingrich and of his own. The Republican Party spent the 20th century urging Americans to believe that civil institutions of government were all illegitimate and imposed on the people from without, as if they were our Martian overlords. This estrangement from reality has resulted in the current state of affairs.

    In the GWB administration, Canadian Frum was such a Tyro – with a sort of a Mortimer J. Adler-esque, ‘Boys, send in your boxtops and get a free history degree’ view of the United States – that he was mostly good for the stream of endlessly stupid things that came out of his bright shiny mouth. Now, he’s a ‘senior editor’ at The Atlantic, where, since Mort Zuckerman sold the venerable rag to David Bradley and such colossuses of letters as the psychopathic, discredited Michael Kelly – and P.J. O’Rourke, for crying out loud – arrived to have their oily escutcheons laundered by 140 years of honest journalism, the magazine has been a sorry place where intellectual integrity goes to die.

    • William – SF

      Forum would do well to have Mr. Frum on after they’ve exhausted the list of investigative writers that Fresh Air finds. Less opinion and more substance.

      • WBryanH

        Fresh Air has had Frum as a guest, just to note…

        • William – SF

          Yes. It’s the investigative writers/reporters (those with more facts and fewer opinions) that I find more informative and interesting, and would prefer Forum to interview before the Frums of the political world.

          • WBryanH

            Yes, I agree with you

  • concerneth

    First: whatever Russia did to interfere had essentially no influence on voters.

    Second: Most Presidents and their families have benefitted financial during and certainly after their presidencies. Bush oil. Clinton real estate. Etc.

    Third: You cannot impeach someone because you disagree with policy or personality. You should have some respect for voters on the other side.

    Fourth: What evidence do you have of collusion? Specifically? Why not let the Mueller invistigation run its course? What if he is exhonerated by the investigation? Will you drop the call for impeachment?

    Fifth: What about the actions from Democrats including survallience, debate questions, dossier and doing a Cheney by sourcing itself for a FISA?

    I get it Trump is crude and bafoonish – but he was elected because policy in America has not been good for what you call “the flyover” states.

    Lastly, anything Russia has done pails in comparison to USA meddling the world over.

    PS: Frum talks of Republicans going from hating to loving Putin (which I disagree is accurate) what about Democrats with Comey?

    Call the kettle black.

    • WBryanH

      Concerneth you mostly lost me with this your first claim “…whatever Russia did to interfere had essentially no influence on voters…:”

      Fact is, we–the public–simply don’t know that. Yet.

      However, I totally agree we need to let the Mueller investigation run its course.

      • concerneth

        Ok let me rephrase: HRC did not lose because of Russian influence. She lost because she is a poor campaigner who failed to speak to the concerns of people in the rust belt who have been negatively impacted by NAFTA for 30+ years.

        No one changed their vote because of a Russian advert on Facebook or the “revelation” through hacked emails that HRC is a corrupt, incompetent cheat. (Most of us knew that long before she lost to Obama)

        And btw…if HRC was the best qualified person to ever run why was Obama chosen over her? Was she more qualified on paper than George HW Bush? I don’t think so.

        • WBryanH

          Concerneth you say “…HRC did not lose because of Russian influence. …”
          Again, nobody–least not us in the public sphere–can claim that for sure.
          I agree that HRC’s campaign had multiple issues. But again, John and Jane Q Public, they can’t know that the Russians *didn’t* tip the election.

          • Curious

            It is alleged that a Russian company bought $100,000 in Internet pop-up ads. Most of the ads didn’t refer to the candidates but focused on social issues, according to The New York Times.

            Donald Trump spent about half as much on his presidential campaign as Hillary Clinton, who raised almost $600 million, and still won despite all her negative ads. Yet we’re supposed to believe that $100,000 in ads, mostly on issues, somehow brainwashed Americans into voting a particular way?

          • WBryanH

            Mueller & Co is busy sorting through all kinds of evidence that I–and I expect you–have no access to.
            Thus I repeat: Nobody in the public sphere can credibly claim that: “…HRC did not lose because of Russian influence…”

          • WBryanH

            Sure, curious. Please just totally ignore the untold thousands who-knows-how-may fake FB and twitter accounts out there, accounts that promote pro-trump anti-HRC messages, with often funky prose littered with mistakes that native slavic language speakers typically make, such as dropped articles (“a”, “the,” etc), and misplacing the dollar sign (1,000$ instead of $1,000).

          • concerneth

            As someone who grew up in one of those states I can assure you Russia had nothing to do with it.

          • concerneth

            As someone who grew up in one of the states HRC lost but should have won I can assure you that Russia influence has nothing to do with it.

            Maybe Trump had collusion with Rusia maybe he didn’t. The public doesn’t know until the facts from the investigation are revealed.

            Yet still people on the left are calling for impeachment. For what? Because you don’t like his personality? Because you don’t like his policy? Get over it – he was elected.

            And saying he didn’t get popular vote is only an attempt to delegitimize him. Everybody from both sides knew the workings of the electoral process and had the opportunity to adjust their strategy accordingly. If you don’t like the electoral college then push for change in the law.

            It is not surprising that democrats on the coasts were shocked by his election. For at least 3 months, in an effort to influence public perception, the NYT ran on first page their “chances of winning” which is meaningless and bogusly contrived. Always it was 80+ % HRC.

            Most polls had HRC up but the margin varied greatly. Only one single poll accurately tracked the election – usc poll. Additionally the people on the coasts don’t know and don’t care what has been happening in the “flyover” states for 30 years. So not only were they shocked but they also don’t understand how it is possible.

            Enter the blaming Russia. It is not only a scapegoat for HRC but also gives them an excuse to continue to try to oust him because frankly they are bitter they lost and they dont like him and his policies.

            Its pathetic really. And HRC is the most pathetic of all, what with her continuing to try to be in the public conversation. Especially after what she did to Bernie Sanders. She should be ashamed. But Clintons don’t know that word: shame.

            Do people think that finding collusion with Russia will void the election results? If there was and it rises to the level of impeachable offense (which seems like a stretch) then guess what? You will have Pence. PENCE! Goodluck with that.

          • WBryanH

            concerneth, you claim: “…As someone who grew up in one of the states HRC lost but should have won I can assure you that Russia influence has nothing to do with it…”

            No concerneth. You most assuredly CAN’T “assure” anybody of that.

            Whether you live in Texas or Talkeetna, Putin’s troll army can reach right into your computer and smartphone, expertly pretending to be right-wing Pro Trump Americans.

            Nobody has to identify himself on much of social media, including Facebook and Twitter. You see anonymous accounts all over the place.

            concerneth, those are just the abundantly self-evident facts.

          • concerneth

            How old are you I wonder. I appreciate your effort to hold me to a high standard of truth. But you don’t understand – those people were voting on the economy. Nothing to do with what is on their phones are on their televisions.

            This is what I am trying to explain to you. The structure and nature of these economies has changed for the worse for 30+ years. They are voting on real things in their lives.

            Do you really believe Russia seripitiously convinced people en mass to vote for Trump?

            YES – yes I absolutely can assure you Russia did not cause HRC to lose.

            You have to understand this was the failing of HRC in this campaign. She was out of touch and did not even attempt to speak to these people’s interests.

            Regardless of what Russia did or did not do you have to look no further than HRC (and the sheep who nominated her) for the responsibility of losing the election.

            If I weren’t from one of these places I would probably wonder how the hell Trump got elected also.

          • WBryanH

            How you feel concerneth.
            Or how they pay you to “feel.”

          • concerneth

            I am not getting paid by anyone to feel, write, or say anything.

          • WBryanH

            concerneth we have no idea who you are. You can say anything you’d like and we have no way to verify it.
            For all we know, you work out of the troll house in St Petersburg Russia.

          • concerneth

            If it is convenient for you to believe that then it looks like you will.

            Why am I the one working from the troll house? Maybe its you!

            You are refusing to open your mind to what I am telling you from personal experience. That is your choice.

            But to go further and make up a story and accusations about who you imagine I am… is it paranoa? Denial? Pride? All of the above?

            That is a great example of the hysteria coming from the left and it is sad. The right used to be the more insane congregation. Now its both.

            I don’t get paid for posting. I don’t work for any government or political organisation. Sorry to disappoint you.

            You don’t want a reasonable conversation based on logic. You want to believe what you want to believe so you can behave in this manner.

            Identity politics is killing us. Lack of empathy is killing us. Ego, killing is. Ignorance, killing us.

            If the investigation reveals Trump colluded then he will face the consequences. We don’t know if he did or did not until finishes.

            But I am telling you – even if he did – it was not the reason HRC lost. Sorry to burst your bubble. Maybe you should have picked a better candidate and given a $hit about people in other regions.

          • WBryanH

            Like I said concerneth. How you feel and so forth. You can say anything you please. We have no idea who you are. We have no way to verify your claims of “personal experience.” You are invisible to us.
            But again, I agree, Mueller must be allowed to fully investigate and to finish his investigation

          • concerneth

            You don’t have to verify my claim. You can believe it or not believe it. I know it from personal experience. It would do you good to consider this perspective even if you don’t believe me. This is my last waste of time message on thus thread. Go ahead, have the last word.

          • WBryanH

            доверяй, но проверяй. Trust, but verify.

          • concerneth

            Get your head out of the sand WBryanH.

  • Another Mike

    Next time Forum interviews a former GW Bush operative, i would like them to ask how the operative was changed by the experience of working for an administration that lied us into an Iraq invasion that will ultimately cost us more than $4.5 trillion, and did cost us over 4000 brave American lives.

  • Tom Berman

    Frum was a primary advocate of a war policy that resulted in the murder of 500,000 human beings. It’s completely appalling that KQED would feature him simply because he’s willing to tweet against Trump.

  • YUGE

    Frum is a fraud JEW

  • Churbles

    Ah yes, the left, and the “real conservatives”, aka the neo-cons, we are all neo-cons now, Obama and Bush all hugs!

    Nothings gone wrong on the left…nothing at all when Bush the H I T L E R is now your best friend.

Host

Michael Krasny

Michael Krasny, PhD, has been in broadcast journalism since 1983. He was with ABC in both radio and television and migrated to public broadcasting in 1993. He has been Professor of English at San Francisco State University and also taught at Stanford, the University of San Francisco and the University of California, as well as in the Fulbright International Institutes. A veteran interviewer for the nationally broadcast City Arts and Lectures, he is the author of a number of books, including “Off Mike: A Memoir of Talk Radio and Literary Life” (Stanford University Press) “Spiritual Envy” (New World); “Sound Ideas” (with M.E. Sokolik/ McGraw-Hill); “Let There Be Laughter” (Harper-Collins) as well as the twenty-four lecture series in DVD, audio and book, “Short Story Masterpieces” (The Teaching Company). He has interviewed many of the world’s leading political, cultural, literary, science and technology figures, as well as major figures from the world of entertainment. He is the recipient of many awards and honors including the S.Y. Agnon Medal for Intellectual Achievement; The Eugene Block Award for Human Rights Journalism; the James Madison Freedom of Information Award; the Excellence in Journalism Award from the National Lesbian and Gay Journalists Association; Career Achievement Award from the Society of Professional Journalists and an award from the Radio and Television News Directors Association. He holds a B.A. (cum laude) and M.A. from Ohio University and a PhD from the University of Wisconsin.

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