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She focuses on how housing gets built across the Bay Area. Before joining KQED in 2020, she reported for WUNC in Durham, North Carolina, WABE in Atlanta, Georgia and Capital Public Radio in Sacramento. In 2017, she was awarded a Kroc Fellowship at NPR where she reported on everything from sprinkles to the Golden State Killer's arrest. When she's not reporting, she's baking new recipes in her kitchen or watching movies with friends and family. 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Reporter Wilma Consul went to one of the final shows at AsiaSF, and tells us how the groundbreaking venue became a place where people from all over the world could find joy and authenticity.\u003c/p>\n\u003ch2>\u003cstrong>\u003cspan dir=\"auto\">Hunting for California’s New State Mushroom\u003c/span>\u003c/strong>\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>California has had a state flower and state animal for awhile now, but this year we finally got an official state mushroom. KQED’s Danielle Venton takes us foraging to try to find the Golden Chanterelle.\u003c/p>\n\u003ch2 class=\"routes-Site-routes-Post-Title-__Title__title\">\u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11977464/to-fight-rising-rents-these-fresno-county-residents-bought-their-mobile-home-park\">To Fight Rising Rents, These Fresno County Residents Bought Their Mobile Home Park\u003c/a>\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>In Fresno County, a group of farmworkers living in a mobile home park did something that might seem impossible in a time of rising housing costs: They bought the park from their corporate landlords. The California Report’s Madi Bolanos tells us how they did it.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad fullwidth]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n","blocks":[],"excerpt":null,"status":"publish","parent":0,"modified":1714768564,"stats":{"hasAudio":false,"hasVideo":false,"hasChartOrMap":false,"iframeSrcs":[],"hasGoogleForm":false,"hasGallery":false,"hasHearkenModule":false,"hasPolis":false,"paragraphCount":6,"wordCount":201},"headData":{"title":"Saying Goodbye to AsiaSF; New State Mushroom; Farm Workers Buy Mobile Home Park | KQED","description":"Listen to this and more in-depth storytelling by subscribing to The California Report Magazine podcast. ‘I’m Gonna Miss It’: Inside One of AsiaSF’s Last Live Cabarets in the SoMa Famous for showcasing transgender performers for more than a quarter century, AsiaSF, the beloved San Francisco restaurant and club, closed its doors this week. Reporter Wilma Consul went to one of the final shows at AsiaSF, and tells us how the groundbreaking venue became a place where people from all over the world could find joy and authenticity. Hunting for California's New State Mushroom California has had a state flower and","ogTitle":"","ogDescription":"","ogImgId":"","twTitle":"","twDescription":"","twImgId":"","schema":{"@context":"http://schema.org","@type":"NewsArticle","headline":"Saying Goodbye to AsiaSF; New State Mushroom; Farm Workers Buy Mobile Home Park","datePublished":"2024-05-03T19:00:21.000Z","dateModified":"2024-05-03T20:36:04.000Z","image":"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/KQED-OG-Image@1x.png","isAccessibleForFree":"Y","publisher":{"@type":"NewsMediaOrganization","@id":"https://www.kqed.org/#organization","name":"KQED","url":"https://www.kqed.org","logo":"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/KQED-OG-Image@1x.png"}}},"source":"The California Report Magazine","sourceUrl":"https://www.kqed.org/news/tag/tcrmag/ ","audioUrl":"https://www.podtrac.com/pts/redirect.mp3/chrt.fm/track/G6C7C3/traffic.megaphone.fm/KQINC2557955843.mp3?updated=1714611932","sticky":false,"nprStoryId":"kqed-11984739","excludeFromSiteSearch":"Include","articleAge":"0","path":"/news/11984739/saying-goodbye-to-asiasf-new-state-mushroom-farm-workers-buy-mobile-home-park","audioTrackLength":null,"parsedContent":[{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003cp>\u003cem>\u003ca href=\"http://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/the-california-report-magazine/id1314750545?mt=2\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Listen to this and more in-depth storytelling by subscribing to The California Report Magazine podcast.\u003c/a>\u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\u003ch2 class=\"routes-Site-routes-Post-Title-__Title__title\">\u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11984363/im-gonna-miss-it-inside-one-of-asiasfs-last-live-cabarets-in-the-soma\">‘I’m Gonna Miss It’: Inside One of AsiaSF’s Last Live Cabarets in the SoMa\u003c/a>\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>Famous for showcasing transgender performers for more than a quarter century, AsiaSF, the beloved San Francisco restaurant and club, closed its doors this week. Reporter Wilma Consul went to one of the final shows at AsiaSF, and tells us how the groundbreaking venue became a place where people from all over the world could find joy and authenticity.\u003c/p>\n\u003ch2>\u003cstrong>\u003cspan dir=\"auto\">Hunting for California’s New State Mushroom\u003c/span>\u003c/strong>\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>California has had a state flower and state animal for awhile now, but this year we finally got an official state mushroom. KQED’s Danielle Venton takes us foraging to try to find the Golden Chanterelle.\u003c/p>\n\u003ch2 class=\"routes-Site-routes-Post-Title-__Title__title\">\u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11977464/to-fight-rising-rents-these-fresno-county-residents-bought-their-mobile-home-park\">To Fight Rising Rents, These Fresno County Residents Bought Their Mobile Home Park\u003c/a>\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>In Fresno County, a group of farmworkers living in a mobile home park did something that might seem impossible in a time of rising housing costs: They bought the park from their corporate landlords. 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This year, we hear from teens at Fremont High School in East Oakland. They share the challenges they face right now and tell us why they feel so misunderstood.\u003c/p>\n\u003ch2>\u003ca href=\"https://laist.com/news/education/sylmar-charter-high-school-floriculture-horticulture-program-prom-flowers\">\u003cstrong>\u003cspan dir=\"auto\">Sylmar Teens Grow Their Own Flowers For the Prom \u003c/span>\u003c/strong>\u003c/a>\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">In the San Fernando Valley, high school seniors have taken over one of the most anticipated rights of passage: prom. LAist’s Mariana Dale discovered a program at Sylmar Charter High School where students don’t just choose the theme and set up decorations: They actually \u003c/span>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">grow \u003c/span>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">and arrange the \u003c/span>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">flowers \u003c/span>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">for the big event.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003ch2>\u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11980715/why-dont-more-bay-area-kids-ride-school-buses\">\u003cstrong>\u003cspan dir=\"auto\">Why Doesn’t California Have More School Buses?\u003c/span>\u003c/strong>\u003c/a>\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">How kids get to and from school is a big part of the school experience for many kids. But if you’ve been looking closely you may have noticed there aren’t as many school buses as there are in other states. Katrina Schwartz, who’s a producer with KQED’s Bay Curious podcast, set out to figure out why that is. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad fullwidth]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n","blocks":[],"excerpt":"It’s Youth Takeover week at KQED and we're handing the mic to students from East Oakland's Fremont High School. ","status":"publish","parent":0,"modified":1714157102,"stats":{"hasAudio":false,"hasVideo":false,"hasChartOrMap":false,"iframeSrcs":[],"hasGoogleForm":false,"hasGallery":false,"hasHearkenModule":false,"hasPolis":false,"paragraphCount":6,"wordCount":220},"headData":{"title":"Youth Takeover: Parents (and Teachers) Just Don't Understand | KQED","description":"It’s Youth Takeover week here at KQED, a time when we hand the mics over to local high school students. This year, we hear from teens at Fremont High School in East Oakland. 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This year, we hear from teens at Fremont High School in East Oakland. They share the challenges they face right now and tell us why they feel so misunderstood.\u003c/p>\n\u003ch2>\u003ca href=\"https://laist.com/news/education/sylmar-charter-high-school-floriculture-horticulture-program-prom-flowers\">\u003cstrong>\u003cspan dir=\"auto\">Sylmar Teens Grow Their Own Flowers For the Prom \u003c/span>\u003c/strong>\u003c/a>\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">In the San Fernando Valley, high school seniors have taken over one of the most anticipated rights of passage: prom. LAist’s Mariana Dale discovered a program at Sylmar Charter High School where students don’t just choose the theme and set up decorations: They actually \u003c/span>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">grow \u003c/span>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">and arrange the \u003c/span>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">flowers \u003c/span>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">for the big event.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003ch2>\u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11980715/why-dont-more-bay-area-kids-ride-school-buses\">\u003cstrong>\u003cspan dir=\"auto\">Why Doesn’t California Have More School Buses?\u003c/span>\u003c/strong>\u003c/a>\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">How kids get to and from school is a big part of the school experience for many kids. But if you’ve been looking closely you may have noticed there aren’t as many school buses as there are in other states. Katrina Schwartz, who’s a producer with KQED’s Bay Curious podcast, set out to figure out why that is. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"ad","attributes":{"named":{"label":"fullwidth"},"numeric":["fullwidth"]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003c/div>\u003c/p>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}}],"link":"/news/11983949/youth-takeover-parents-and-teachers-just-dont-understand","authors":["236"],"programs":["news_72","news_26731"],"categories":["news_21291"],"tags":["news_5438","news_20004","news_126","news_23013","news_33987"],"featImg":"news_11983951","label":"source_news_11983949"},"news_11982681":{"type":"posts","id":"news_11982681","meta":{"index":"posts_1591205157","site":"news","id":"11982681","score":null,"sort":[1712948429000]},"guestAuthors":[],"slug":"why-italians-in-california-were-treated-as-enemy-aliens-during-wwii-reality-tv-workers-feeling-industry-cutbacks","title":"Why Italians in California Were Treated as 'Enemy Aliens' During WWII; Reality TV Workers Feeling Industry Cutbacks","publishDate":1712948429,"format":"standard","headTitle":"Why Italians in California Were Treated as ‘Enemy Aliens’ During WWII; Reality TV Workers Feeling Industry Cutbacks | KQED","labelTerm":{},"content":"\u003cp>\u003cem>\u003ca href=\"http://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/the-california-report-magazine/id1314750545?mt=2\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Listen to this and more in-depth storytelling by subscribing to The California Report Magazine podcast.\u003c/a>\u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\u003ch2 class=\"routes-Site-routes-Post-Title-__Title__title\">\u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11969411/how-bay-area-italians-were-treated-as-enemy-aliens-during-wwii\">Why Italians in California Were Treated as ‘Enemy Aliens’ During WWII\u003c/a>\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>Within months of the attack on Pearl Harbor in December 1941, as more than 100,000 Japanese Americans were being sent to incarceration camps, other ethnic groups also became the target of new wartime security measures. Italian citizens living near California’s coastline and military sites — some 10,000 of them — were forced to leave their homes and find somewhere else to live. It was just one of many government measures meant to protect the West Coast from an enemy invasion that never came. Reporter Pauline Bartolone brings us this story from the Bay Curious podcast.\u003c/p>\n\u003ch2>\u003cstrong>\u003ca class=\"c-link c-message_attachment__title_link\" href=\"https://www.kcrw.com/news/shows/kcrw-features/reality-tv\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" data-qa=\"message_attachment_title_link\">\u003cspan dir=\"auto\">Some Reality TV Workers Say They’re Reaching a Breaking Point\u003c/span>\u003c/a>\u003c/strong>\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>From blind dates to tiny homes, the number of reality tv shows has grown in recent years. But some workers say the success of the industry hasn’t translated into stability for people behind the scenes. Guest host Bianca Taylor talks to KCRW’s Megan Jamerson, who says recent cutbacks have some reality TV workers feeling overworked and underpaid.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad fullwidth]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n","blocks":[],"excerpt":null,"status":"publish","parent":0,"modified":1712953599,"stats":{"hasAudio":false,"hasVideo":false,"hasChartOrMap":false,"iframeSrcs":[],"hasGoogleForm":false,"hasGallery":false,"hasHearkenModule":false,"hasPolis":false,"paragraphCount":5,"wordCount":204},"headData":{"title":"Why Italians in California Were Treated as 'Enemy Aliens' During WWII; Reality TV Workers Feeling Industry Cutbacks | KQED","description":"Listen to this and more in-depth storytelling by subscribing to The California Report Magazine podcast. Why Italians in California Were Treated as ‘Enemy Aliens’ During WWII Within months of the attack on Pearl Harbor in December 1941, as more than 100,000 Japanese Americans were being sent to incarceration camps, other ethnic groups also became the target of new wartime security measures. Italian citizens living near California’s coastline and military sites — some 10,000 of them — were forced to leave their homes and find somewhere else to live. It was just one of many government measures meant to protect the","ogTitle":"","ogDescription":"","ogImgId":"","twTitle":"","twDescription":"","twImgId":"","schema":{"@context":"http://schema.org","@type":"NewsArticle","headline":"Why Italians in California Were Treated as 'Enemy Aliens' During WWII; Reality TV Workers Feeling Industry Cutbacks","datePublished":"2024-04-12T19:00:29.000Z","dateModified":"2024-04-12T20:26:39.000Z","image":"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/KQED-OG-Image@1x.png","isAccessibleForFree":"Y","publisher":{"@type":"NewsMediaOrganization","@id":"https://www.kqed.org/#organization","name":"KQED","url":"https://www.kqed.org","logo":"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/KQED-OG-Image@1x.png"}}},"source":"The California Report Magazine","sourceUrl":"https://www.kqed.org/news/tag/tcrmag/ ","audioUrl":"https://www.podtrac.com/pts/redirect.mp3/chrt.fm/track/G6C7C3/traffic.megaphone.fm/KQINC9165684292.mp3?updated=1712864450","sticky":false,"excludeFromSiteSearch":"Include","articleAge":"0","path":"/news/11982681/why-italians-in-california-were-treated-as-enemy-aliens-during-wwii-reality-tv-workers-feeling-industry-cutbacks","audioTrackLength":null,"parsedContent":[{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003cp>\u003cem>\u003ca href=\"http://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/the-california-report-magazine/id1314750545?mt=2\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Listen to this and more in-depth storytelling by subscribing to The California Report Magazine podcast.\u003c/a>\u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\u003ch2 class=\"routes-Site-routes-Post-Title-__Title__title\">\u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11969411/how-bay-area-italians-were-treated-as-enemy-aliens-during-wwii\">Why Italians in California Were Treated as ‘Enemy Aliens’ During WWII\u003c/a>\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>Within months of the attack on Pearl Harbor in December 1941, as more than 100,000 Japanese Americans were being sent to incarceration camps, other ethnic groups also became the target of new wartime security measures. Italian citizens living near California’s coastline and military sites — some 10,000 of them — were forced to leave their homes and find somewhere else to live. It was just one of many government measures meant to protect the West Coast from an enemy invasion that never came. Reporter Pauline Bartolone brings us this story from the Bay Curious podcast.\u003c/p>\n\u003ch2>\u003cstrong>\u003ca class=\"c-link c-message_attachment__title_link\" href=\"https://www.kcrw.com/news/shows/kcrw-features/reality-tv\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\" data-qa=\"message_attachment_title_link\">\u003cspan dir=\"auto\">Some Reality TV Workers Say They’re Reaching a Breaking Point\u003c/span>\u003c/a>\u003c/strong>\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>From blind dates to tiny homes, the number of reality tv shows has grown in recent years. But some workers say the success of the industry hasn’t translated into stability for people behind the scenes. Guest host Bianca Taylor talks to KCRW’s Megan Jamerson, who says recent cutbacks have some reality TV workers feeling overworked and underpaid.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"ad","attributes":{"named":{"label":"fullwidth"},"numeric":["fullwidth"]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003c/div>\u003c/p>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}}],"link":"/news/11982681/why-italians-in-california-were-treated-as-enemy-aliens-during-wwii-reality-tv-workers-feeling-industry-cutbacks","authors":["236"],"programs":["news_72","news_26731"],"categories":["news_8"],"tags":["news_5438","news_20004","news_126"],"featImg":"news_11982687","label":"source_news_11982681"},"news_11981609":{"type":"posts","id":"news_11981609","meta":{"index":"posts_1591205157","site":"news","id":"11981609","score":null,"sort":[1712343498000]},"guestAuthors":[],"slug":"making-a-home-in-fire-country","title":"Making a Home in Fire Country","publishDate":1712343498,"format":"standard","headTitle":"Making a Home in Fire Country | KQED","labelTerm":{},"content":"\u003cp>\u003cem>\u003ca href=\"http://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/the-california-report-magazine/id1314750545?mt=2\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Listen to this and more in-depth storytelling by subscribing to The California Report Magazine podcast.\u003c/a>\u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\u003ch2 class=\"routes-Site-routes-Post-Title-__Title__title\">\u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/science/1985440/draft-living-in-californias-sierra-foothills-residents-confront-climate-change\">Facing the Fire: California’s Sierra Foothills Residents Race to Adapt\u003c/a>\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>This week, we’re featuring a story from Erin Baldassari, KQED’s Senior Editor for Housing Affordability. Erin’s reporting took her back to Nevada County, where she grew up.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>She wanted to learn how people there are adapting to the rising risk of wildfires due to climate change. And she started by asking folks the same question she’s been asking herself: “What do you do if climate change makes the place you love an increasingly dangerous place to live?”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Erin’s story comes to us from the KQED podcast, \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/podcasts/soldout\">Sold Out: Rethinking Housing in America.\u003c/a>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad fullwidth]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n","blocks":[],"excerpt":null,"status":"publish","parent":0,"modified":1712193103,"stats":{"hasAudio":false,"hasVideo":false,"hasChartOrMap":false,"iframeSrcs":[],"hasGoogleForm":false,"hasGallery":false,"hasHearkenModule":false,"hasPolis":false,"paragraphCount":6,"wordCount":134},"headData":{"title":"Making a Home in Fire Country | KQED","description":"Listen to this and more in-depth storytelling by subscribing to The California Report Magazine podcast. Facing the Fire: California’s Sierra Foothills Residents Race to Adapt This week, we’re featuring a story from Erin Baldassari, KQED’s Senior Editor for Housing Affordability. Erin’s reporting took her back to Nevada County, where she grew up. She wanted to","ogTitle":"","ogDescription":"","ogImgId":"","twTitle":"","twDescription":"","twImgId":"","schema":{"@context":"http://schema.org","@type":"NewsArticle","headline":"Making a Home in Fire Country","datePublished":"2024-04-05T18:58:18.000Z","dateModified":"2024-04-04T01:11:43.000Z","image":"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/KQED-OG-Image@1x.png","isAccessibleForFree":"Y","publisher":{"@type":"NewsMediaOrganization","@id":"https://www.kqed.org/#organization","name":"KQED","url":"https://www.kqed.org","logo":"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/KQED-OG-Image@1x.png"}}},"source":"The California Report Magazine","sourceUrl":"https://www.kqed.org/news/tag/tcrmag/ ","audioUrl":"https://www.podtrac.com/pts/redirect.mp3/chrt.fm/track/G6C7C3/traffic.megaphone.fm/KQINC7036253671.mp3?updated=1711743711","sticky":false,"excludeFromSiteSearch":"Include","articleAge":"0","path":"/news/11981609/making-a-home-in-fire-country","audioTrackLength":null,"parsedContent":[{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003cp>\u003cem>\u003ca href=\"http://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/the-california-report-magazine/id1314750545?mt=2\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Listen to this and more in-depth storytelling by subscribing to The California Report Magazine podcast.\u003c/a>\u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\u003ch2 class=\"routes-Site-routes-Post-Title-__Title__title\">\u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/science/1985440/draft-living-in-californias-sierra-foothills-residents-confront-climate-change\">Facing the Fire: California’s Sierra Foothills Residents Race to Adapt\u003c/a>\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>This week, we’re featuring a story from Erin Baldassari, KQED’s Senior Editor for Housing Affordability. Erin’s reporting took her back to Nevada County, where she grew up.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>She wanted to learn how people there are adapting to the rising risk of wildfires due to climate change. And she started by asking folks the same question she’s been asking herself: “What do you do if climate change makes the place you love an increasingly dangerous place to live?”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Erin’s story comes to us from the KQED podcast, \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/podcasts/soldout\">Sold Out: Rethinking Housing in America.\u003c/a>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"ad","attributes":{"named":{"label":"fullwidth"},"numeric":["fullwidth"]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003c/div>\u003c/p>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}}],"link":"/news/11981609/making-a-home-in-fire-country","authors":["236"],"programs":["news_72","news_26731"],"categories":["news_8"],"tags":["news_5438","news_20004","news_126"],"featImg":"news_11981612","label":"source_news_11981609"},"news_11980819":{"type":"posts","id":"news_11980819","meta":{"index":"posts_1591205157","site":"news","id":"11980819","score":null,"sort":[1711738843000]},"guestAuthors":[],"slug":"proposition-8s-lessons-for-one-queer-journalist-64-year-old-badass-skate-mom","title":"Proposition 8's Lessons for One Queer Journalist; 64-Year-Old ‘Badass Skate Mom’","publishDate":1711738843,"format":"standard","headTitle":"Proposition 8’s Lessons for One Queer Journalist; 64-Year-Old ‘Badass Skate Mom’ | KQED","labelTerm":{},"content":"\u003cp>\u003cem>\u003ca href=\"http://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/the-california-report-magazine/id1314750545?mt=2\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Listen to this and more in-depth storytelling by subscribing to The California Report Magazine podcast.\u003c/a>\u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\u003ch2 class=\"routes-Site-routes-Post-Title-__Title__title\">\u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11981023/a-queer-journalist-reflects-on-the-legacy-of-the-propostion-8-trial-tapes\">Proposition 8 Trial Tapes Hold Lessons for One Queer Journalist\u003c/a>\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>In November 2008, California voters took away the right to marry from same-sex couples. Proposition 8, won with just over half of the vote. But two years later, two same-sex couples sued the State of California in federal court. Prop 8 was eventually overturned.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>That landmark trial was videotaped, but the recordings were never released to the public. Until a few years ago, when KQED sued for access to the tapes and won. The U.S. Supreme Court \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11911275/supreme-court-ruling-clears-way-for-release-of-footage-from-landmark-trial-that-legalized-same-sex-marriage-in-california\">allowed them to be unsealed in October 2022\u003c/a>.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>KQED’s community engagement reporter Carlos Cabrera Lomeli, spent more than forty hours going through that tape. As a queer journalist covering California’s gay marriage journey, Carlos says he learned a lot about himself in the process.\u003c/p>\n\u003ch2 class=\"routes-Site-routes-Post-Title-__Title__title\">\u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11981066/at-64-santa-cruz-slalom-skateboarding-mom-trains-for-world-games\">64-Year-Old ‘Badass Skate Mom’ Is Headed for the World Skate Games\u003c/a>\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>Judi Oyama first learned to skate in the 1970s on a board her brother made her in wood shop. Today, 50 years into a groundbreaking career, she’s still considered of the best skateboarders in the nation. In fact, Judi recently qualified to race at the World Skate Games in Rome this fall. At 64, Judi says she’s the fastest she’s ever been. KAZU’s Erin Malsbury brings us her story.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad fullwidth]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n","blocks":[],"excerpt":null,"status":"publish","parent":0,"modified":1711756308,"stats":{"hasAudio":false,"hasVideo":false,"hasChartOrMap":false,"iframeSrcs":[],"hasGoogleForm":false,"hasGallery":false,"hasHearkenModule":false,"hasPolis":false,"paragraphCount":7,"wordCount":253},"headData":{"title":"Proposition 8's Lessons for One Queer Journalist; 64-Year-Old ‘Badass Skate Mom’ | KQED","description":"Listen to this and more in-depth storytelling by subscribing to The California Report Magazine podcast. Proposition 8 Trial Tapes Hold Lessons for One Queer Journalist In November 2008, California voters took away the right to marry from same-sex couples. Proposition 8, won with just over half of the vote. But two years later, two same-sex couples sued the State of California in federal court. Prop 8 was eventually overturned. That landmark trial was videotaped, but the recordings were never released to the public. Until a few years ago, when KQED sued for access to the tapes and won. The U.S.","ogTitle":"","ogDescription":"","ogImgId":"","twTitle":"","twDescription":"","twImgId":"","schema":{"@context":"http://schema.org","@type":"NewsArticle","headline":"Proposition 8's Lessons for One Queer Journalist; 64-Year-Old ‘Badass Skate Mom’","datePublished":"2024-03-29T19:00:43.000Z","dateModified":"2024-03-29T23:51:48.000Z","image":"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/KQED-OG-Image@1x.png","isAccessibleForFree":"Y","publisher":{"@type":"NewsMediaOrganization","@id":"https://www.kqed.org/#organization","name":"KQED","url":"https://www.kqed.org","logo":"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/KQED-OG-Image@1x.png"}}},"source":"The California Report Magazine","sourceUrl":"https://www.kqed.org/news/tag/tcrmag/ ","audioUrl":"https://www.podtrac.com/pts/redirect.mp3/chrt.fm/track/G6C7C3/traffic.megaphone.fm/KQINC4923422955.mp3?updated=1711581597","sticky":false,"excludeFromSiteSearch":"Include","articleAge":"0","path":"/news/11980819/proposition-8s-lessons-for-one-queer-journalist-64-year-old-badass-skate-mom","audioTrackLength":null,"parsedContent":[{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003cp>\u003cem>\u003ca href=\"http://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/the-california-report-magazine/id1314750545?mt=2\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Listen to this and more in-depth storytelling by subscribing to The California Report Magazine podcast.\u003c/a>\u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\u003ch2 class=\"routes-Site-routes-Post-Title-__Title__title\">\u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11981023/a-queer-journalist-reflects-on-the-legacy-of-the-propostion-8-trial-tapes\">Proposition 8 Trial Tapes Hold Lessons for One Queer Journalist\u003c/a>\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>In November 2008, California voters took away the right to marry from same-sex couples. Proposition 8, won with just over half of the vote. But two years later, two same-sex couples sued the State of California in federal court. Prop 8 was eventually overturned.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>That landmark trial was videotaped, but the recordings were never released to the public. Until a few years ago, when KQED sued for access to the tapes and won. The U.S. Supreme Court \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11911275/supreme-court-ruling-clears-way-for-release-of-footage-from-landmark-trial-that-legalized-same-sex-marriage-in-california\">allowed them to be unsealed in October 2022\u003c/a>.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>KQED’s community engagement reporter Carlos Cabrera Lomeli, spent more than forty hours going through that tape. As a queer journalist covering California’s gay marriage journey, Carlos says he learned a lot about himself in the process.\u003c/p>\n\u003ch2 class=\"routes-Site-routes-Post-Title-__Title__title\">\u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11981066/at-64-santa-cruz-slalom-skateboarding-mom-trains-for-world-games\">64-Year-Old ‘Badass Skate Mom’ Is Headed for the World Skate Games\u003c/a>\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>Judi Oyama first learned to skate in the 1970s on a board her brother made her in wood shop. Today, 50 years into a groundbreaking career, she’s still considered of the best skateboarders in the nation. In fact, Judi recently qualified to race at the World Skate Games in Rome this fall. At 64, Judi says she’s the fastest she’s ever been. KAZU’s Erin Malsbury brings us her story.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"ad","attributes":{"named":{"label":"fullwidth"},"numeric":["fullwidth"]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003c/div>\u003c/p>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}}],"link":"/news/11980819/proposition-8s-lessons-for-one-queer-journalist-64-year-old-badass-skate-mom","authors":["236"],"programs":["news_72","news_26731"],"categories":["news_8"],"tags":["news_5438","news_20004","news_126"],"featImg":"news_11966189","label":"source_news_11980819"},"news_11970658":{"type":"posts","id":"news_11970658","meta":{"index":"posts_1591205157","site":"news","id":"11970658","score":null,"sort":[1703242827000]},"guestAuthors":[],"slug":"the-couple-who-helped-overturn-californias-same-sex-marriage-ban","title":"The Couple Who Helped Overturn California's Same-Sex Marriage Ban","publishDate":1703242827,"format":"audio","headTitle":"The Couple Who Helped Overturn California’s Same-Sex Marriage Ban | KQED","labelTerm":{},"content":"\u003cp>\u003ca href=\"#episode-transcript\">\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">View the full episode transcript.\u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003c/a>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Sandy Stier and Kris Perry were plaintiffs in a landmark case challenging California’s Prop 8, which banned gay marriage in 2008. Their trial went all the way to the Supreme Court, and would eventually restore marriage equality to California. \u003c/span>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">This year, KQED invited Stier and Perry to watch unsealed tapes from the trial of their younger selves taking the stand for marriage equality, and to reflect on what it meant to be part of that fight all these years later. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Links:\u003c/p>\n\u003cul>\n\u003cli>\u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11966077/inside-the-trial-that-overturned-californias-same-sex-marriage-ban-proposition-8-mike-johnson-lgbtq-rights\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\">Inside the Trial That Overturned California’s Same-Sex Marriage Ban\u003c/a>\u003c/li>\n\u003c/ul>\n\u003cp>\u003c!-- iframe plugin v.4.3 wordpress.org/plugins/iframe/ -->\u003cbr>\n\u003ciframe loading=\"lazy\" frameborder=\"0\" height=\"200\" scrolling=\"no\" src=\"https://playlist.megaphone.fm/?e=KQINC7526943476\" width=\"100%\" class=\"iframe-class\">\u003c/iframe>\u003c/p>\n\u003ch2 id=\"episode-transcript\">Episode Transcript\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">This is a computer-generated transcript. While our team has reviewed it, there may be errors.\u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad fullwidth]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>I’m Ericka Cruz Guevarra, and welcome to the Bay. Local news to keep you rooted. In 2009. Sandy Stier and Kris Perry applied for a marriage license. The two had been living together with their children in Alameda County for years. Their license, however, was denied. That’s because just a year prior, California voters passed prop eight, banning gay marriage.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>Stier and Perry, a lesbian couple, would later become plaintiffs in a case that would go all the way up to the Supreme Court and restore marriage equality in California. It’s been ten years since then, and last month, KQED Scott Shafer and Carlos Cabrera-Lomelí invited Stier and Perry to KQED to watch their younger selves go on stand. To defend their right to marry.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Kris Perry: \u003c/strong>Policies that institutionalize unfairness. The group that’s unequal believes that they’re not equal. It’s powerful. Policy is powerful.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>Today, you’re going to hear from Stier and Perry in their own words, as they reflect back on their long battle for marriage equality and what it’s meant to them to be part of this monumental case all these years later. Stay with us.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Kris Perry: \u003c/strong>I am Kris Perry. I’m a plaintiff in the case that challenged proposition eight and was ruled on by the United States Supreme Court.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Sandy Stier: \u003c/strong>My name was Sandy Stier, and I was a plaintiff in Perry versus Schwarzenegger, which ended up being called Hollingsworth versus Perry in the United State Supreme Court. And that is the case that restored marriage equality to California. You know, before we went to the trial, we we were certainly both very anxious about it, but also, you know, kind of saying it’s going to be fine, you’re going to do great, you’re going to be good. And so we just tried to kind of hold each other up and and give each other a lot of support. And we were clenching hands before we went up.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Why are you a plaintiff in this case?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Sandy Stier: \u003c/strong>Well, I’m a plaintiff, as in this case, because I would like to get married, and I would like to marry the person that I choose, and that is Kris Perry. So I did not come out until much later in life. So when I was right out of college mirrors or receiver, I would move to California, got married to a man, got two kids and knew that something wasn’t working for me. I couldn’t fully understand that for quite some time. And I fell in love with Kris. That’s when I understood, first of all, the concept of falling in love, which until then, I don’t think I can wrap my head around until I actually experienced it for myself.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>In general terms, how did that relationship grow and what did what did it grow into?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Kris Perry: \u003c/strong>Well, I remember the first time I met Sandy thinking she was maybe the sparkliest person I’d ever met. And, um, and I wanted to be her friend. And we were friends for a few years, and and our friendship became more and more, um, it became deeper and deeper over time and, and and then after a few years, I began to feel that I might be falling in love with her.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Sandy Stier: \u003c/strong>I really felt like the thunderbolt of a change for me. I was so struck by my feelings and the intensity of them. I felt like it just sort of took over my life. I felt like I just grabbed something and held on and did not let go of no matter what.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Kris Perry: \u003c/strong>So we were pretty clear early on that we wanted it to be long term, and that we had to take the steps to make that happen.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Sandy Stier: \u003c/strong>And so I just felt like no matter what, I’m going to hold on to this because this person that I love, I’m crazy about, I will not let go of, I will not. No matter what.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>You learn in some way that the mayor of the City of San Francisco had authorized the issuance of marriage licenses and the performance of marriage in San Francisco. Am I stating that correctly? Yes. Was that that was in the early part of 2004?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Kris Perry: \u003c/strong>Yes. For us, it was February of 2004.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>And what did you did you act on that information?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Kris Perry: \u003c/strong>I did, I, um, I, Sandy and I both were. We’re reading about it in the newspaper, and we talked about whether or not we would want to. I would go to San Francisco to have this, the marriage and then continue with our other plans. And that’s what we decided we want to do. So we made an appointment and we went to City Hall and we brought, um, all of the boys and my mom and we were married in City Hall. A few weeks after our August ceremony, the state Supreme Court ruled that the San Francisco weddings were invalid.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Kris Perry: \u003c/strong>Policy is powerful, and I you internalize that state. You internalize those policies and beliefs into your own psyche. And for me, I really believed I wasn’t as good as heterosexual married people.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Sandy Stier: \u003c/strong>It’s amazing. She’s a really strong person. Professionally, personally and just every way. But to see what that had done to her. To see what living with discrimination had done to her. The painful to know that about. To have to bear witness to that suffering. I had never felt like I wouldn’t have access to marriage. I always thought I would.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Sandy Stier: \u003c/strong>And then when I didn’t have access to marry the person I fell in love with, I was just outraged. I didn’t feel like there was something wrong with me. I thought there was something wrong with the society, with the world, with the process. I thought, this is weird. It’s an absurd thing to to be voted on. And I couldn’t believe, quite frankly, that the majority of my fellow Californians chose to discriminate against me and every other couple or person like me.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Sandy Stier: \u003c/strong>The fact that proposition eight had gone to the voters of California seemed so wrong that people in the in the state could vote on our what we consider to be a fundamental right. Felt like the wrong way to use a political process. And so we felt like maybe it belongs in the judiciary, because do you can you have the majority of the people decide on your rights? That’s not fair. It’s just fundamentally not fair. And as a protected class, we need to have protection. And so with that, like the judicial, you know, the judicial process is where you find protection.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Did you feel that voters were being warned that they needed to protect their children from you?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Kris Perry: \u003c/strong>Yes, I did, and I felt like. I was being used. That my the fact that I, you know, I am the way I am and I can’t change the way I am, was being mocked and made fun of and disparaged in a way that I like that really didn’t have any way to respond to it. I just had to know that people felt that way.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Kris Perry: \u003c/strong>We didn’t make the decision to be plaintiffs without first checking in with the kids, and they each, in their own way, said, this is important. And of course, you should do it if we want you to succeed. And then finally, that we were in a position to do it. We were in a privileged position. We had a secure life, we had good jobs. We had children who were healthy. We had support of the family and friends. And it was we lived in a supportive community. It was it. We should do it.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>What is your relationship with plaintiff Sandra Stier?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Kris Perry: \u003c/strong>Um, well, Sandy is the woman I love.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Kris Perry: \u003c/strong>What happens is you take care of other people’s homophobia. Like, I don’t want to make you feel homophobic, so I’ll be less gay around you. There’s this weird, unspoken dynamic, like you kind of closet yourself. Anyway, so this we we get we gave all that up by being plaintiffs. So we were so obviously out and we cared so much that we weren’t able to play that role anymore. We were just going to be us.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Kris Perry: \u003c/strong>I remember feeling very anxious and, um, scared, honestly not knowing how any of it would turn out, what the questions might be from the other side, how I would hold up if I would get emotional and break down a little bit, and how would I cope with that in the moment? So I was really projecting out about that, not doing a good job and and wanting to be strong. People were really the counting on us to deliver and there was a lot of pressure.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Sandy Stier: \u003c/strong>We did a lot of our trial preparation together in the same room, and that process was grueling. And also, I felt like I learned yet more about Kris and our experiences, and because we had a lot of the preparation together. I think we felt great empathy for each other, you know, for what we’ve gone through. That’s the same as what we’ve gone through. That’s quite different.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Kris Perry: \u003c/strong>We spent quite a bit of time with the lawyers practicing the answers, but more importantly, thinking deeply about our experience as a couple that had been discriminated against. And what did it really mean, and how did it really impact us and our children? So it wasn’t so much the answers as just understanding ourselves.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Being a plaintiff in a case, trying to change the Constitution, is it a burden or is it something that, um, that’s easy for you, um, because of what it means? Tell us about that.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Sandy Stier: \u003c/strong>It doesn’t feel like a burden. It just I feel like a little tiny person in this, this huge country that just. I just want my my rights.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Kris Perry: \u003c/strong>Part of this case was also intended to change public opinion. And that includes our families who live in conservative parts of the state or the country. And one thing we knew, no matter what the outcome of the trial was, was that the public was moving in our direction, that the polling was changing very rapidly, and that included our families. And in the short amount of time we could see them make the shift.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Tell us what it means to you as a plaintiff in this case if you were to be successful. How would change your life?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Sandy Stier: \u003c/strong>Well, I think it would change my life dramatically. Um, the first time somebody said to me, are you married? And I said, yes, I would think, oh, what? That feels good.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Kris Perry: \u003c/strong>Today is a great day for American children and families. Sandy. And I want to say how happy we are not only to be able to return to California and finally get married, but to be able to say to the children in California, no matter where you live, no matter who you your parents are, no matter what family you’re in. You are equal.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Sandy Stier: \u003c/strong>It felt. I don’t want to say that, great cause that’s an understatement. Yep. It really did change our lives. I more that I think I thought it would.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Kris Perry: \u003c/strong>And the depth of trust and the faith that you’re able to have because you’re not preoccupied with losing it, that you get to actually invest in it. The actual marriage, not in getting married, but being married. Wow. That’s just so different. And that that and I’m still feel grateful for it.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Sandy Stier: \u003c/strong>Words mean something. And I think that was part of the what we learned at trial. Words mean something. They have power. The word marriage means something. And if it didn’t mean something, we wouldn’t want it. And if it didn’t mean something, other people wouldn’t fight to try to keep us from having it.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>That was Kris Perry and Sandy Stier, two plaintiffs in the landmark lawsuit that overturned prop eight. In conversation with KQED, Scott Shafer and Carlos Cabrera-Lomelí This conversation was cut down and edited by producer Maria Esquinca. It was produced and scored by Adhiti Bandlamudi, who also added all the tape.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad floatright]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>The rest of our podcast team here at KQED includes Jen Chien, our director of podcasts, Katie Sprenger, our podcast operations manager, Cesar Saldana, our podcast engagement producer, Maha Sanad, our podcast engagement intern, and Holly Kernan, our chief content officer. And I’m Ericka Cruz Guevarra from me and the entire Bay team. Happy holidays y’all. Take care.\u003c/p>\n\n","blocks":[],"excerpt":"Sandy Stier and Kris Perry were plaintiffs in a landmark case challenging California’s Prop 8, which banned gay marriage in 2008.","status":"publish","parent":0,"modified":1704913381,"stats":{"hasAudio":true,"hasVideo":false,"hasChartOrMap":false,"iframeSrcs":[],"hasGoogleForm":false,"hasGallery":false,"hasHearkenModule":false,"hasPolis":false,"paragraphCount":48,"wordCount":2418},"headData":{"title":"The Couple Who Helped Overturn California's Same-Sex Marriage Ban | KQED","description":"Sandy Stier and Kris Perry were plaintiffs in a landmark case challenging California’s Prop 8, which banned gay marriage in 2008.","ogTitle":"","ogDescription":"","ogImgId":"","twTitle":"","twDescription":"","twImgId":"","schema":{"@context":"http://schema.org","@type":"NewsArticle","headline":"The Couple Who Helped Overturn California's Same-Sex Marriage Ban","datePublished":"2023-12-22T11:00:27.000Z","dateModified":"2024-01-10T19:03:01.000Z","image":"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/KQED-OG-Image@1x.png","isAccessibleForFree":"Y","publisher":{"@type":"NewsMediaOrganization","@id":"https://www.kqed.org/#organization","name":"KQED","url":"https://www.kqed.org","logo":"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/KQED-OG-Image@1x.png"}}},"source":"The Bay","sourceUrl":"https://www.kqed.org/podcasts/thebay","audioUrl":"https://www.podtrac.com/pts/redirect.mp3/chrt.fm/track/G6C7C3/traffic.megaphone.fm/KQINC7526943476.mp3?updated=1703196741","sticky":false,"excludeFromSiteSearch":"Include","articleAge":"0","path":"/news/11970658/the-couple-who-helped-overturn-californias-same-sex-marriage-ban","audioTrackLength":null,"parsedContent":[{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003cp>\u003ca href=\"#episode-transcript\">\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">View the full episode transcript.\u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003c/a>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Sandy Stier and Kris Perry were plaintiffs in a landmark case challenging California’s Prop 8, which banned gay marriage in 2008. Their trial went all the way to the Supreme Court, and would eventually restore marriage equality to California. \u003c/span>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">This year, KQED invited Stier and Perry to watch unsealed tapes from the trial of their younger selves taking the stand for marriage equality, and to reflect on what it meant to be part of that fight all these years later. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Links:\u003c/p>\n\u003cul>\n\u003cli>\u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11966077/inside-the-trial-that-overturned-californias-same-sex-marriage-ban-proposition-8-mike-johnson-lgbtq-rights\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\">Inside the Trial That Overturned California’s Same-Sex Marriage Ban\u003c/a>\u003c/li>\n\u003c/ul>\n\u003cp>\u003c!-- iframe plugin v.4.3 wordpress.org/plugins/iframe/ -->\u003cbr>\n\u003ciframe loading=\"lazy\" frameborder=\"0\" height=\"200\" scrolling=\"no\" src=\"https://playlist.megaphone.fm/?e=KQINC7526943476\" width=\"100%\" class=\"iframe-class\">\u003c/iframe>\u003c/p>\n\u003ch2 id=\"episode-transcript\">Episode Transcript\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">This is a computer-generated transcript. While our team has reviewed it, there may be errors.\u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"ad","attributes":{"named":{"label":"fullwidth"},"numeric":["fullwidth"]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>I’m Ericka Cruz Guevarra, and welcome to the Bay. Local news to keep you rooted. In 2009. Sandy Stier and Kris Perry applied for a marriage license. The two had been living together with their children in Alameda County for years. Their license, however, was denied. That’s because just a year prior, California voters passed prop eight, banning gay marriage.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>Stier and Perry, a lesbian couple, would later become plaintiffs in a case that would go all the way up to the Supreme Court and restore marriage equality in California. It’s been ten years since then, and last month, KQED Scott Shafer and Carlos Cabrera-Lomelí invited Stier and Perry to KQED to watch their younger selves go on stand. To defend their right to marry.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Kris Perry: \u003c/strong>Policies that institutionalize unfairness. The group that’s unequal believes that they’re not equal. It’s powerful. Policy is powerful.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>Today, you’re going to hear from Stier and Perry in their own words, as they reflect back on their long battle for marriage equality and what it’s meant to them to be part of this monumental case all these years later. Stay with us.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Kris Perry: \u003c/strong>I am Kris Perry. I’m a plaintiff in the case that challenged proposition eight and was ruled on by the United States Supreme Court.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Sandy Stier: \u003c/strong>My name was Sandy Stier, and I was a plaintiff in Perry versus Schwarzenegger, which ended up being called Hollingsworth versus Perry in the United State Supreme Court. And that is the case that restored marriage equality to California. You know, before we went to the trial, we we were certainly both very anxious about it, but also, you know, kind of saying it’s going to be fine, you’re going to do great, you’re going to be good. And so we just tried to kind of hold each other up and and give each other a lot of support. And we were clenching hands before we went up.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Why are you a plaintiff in this case?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Sandy Stier: \u003c/strong>Well, I’m a plaintiff, as in this case, because I would like to get married, and I would like to marry the person that I choose, and that is Kris Perry. So I did not come out until much later in life. So when I was right out of college mirrors or receiver, I would move to California, got married to a man, got two kids and knew that something wasn’t working for me. I couldn’t fully understand that for quite some time. And I fell in love with Kris. That’s when I understood, first of all, the concept of falling in love, which until then, I don’t think I can wrap my head around until I actually experienced it for myself.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>In general terms, how did that relationship grow and what did what did it grow into?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Kris Perry: \u003c/strong>Well, I remember the first time I met Sandy thinking she was maybe the sparkliest person I’d ever met. And, um, and I wanted to be her friend. And we were friends for a few years, and and our friendship became more and more, um, it became deeper and deeper over time and, and and then after a few years, I began to feel that I might be falling in love with her.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Sandy Stier: \u003c/strong>I really felt like the thunderbolt of a change for me. I was so struck by my feelings and the intensity of them. I felt like it just sort of took over my life. I felt like I just grabbed something and held on and did not let go of no matter what.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Kris Perry: \u003c/strong>So we were pretty clear early on that we wanted it to be long term, and that we had to take the steps to make that happen.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Sandy Stier: \u003c/strong>And so I just felt like no matter what, I’m going to hold on to this because this person that I love, I’m crazy about, I will not let go of, I will not. No matter what.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>You learn in some way that the mayor of the City of San Francisco had authorized the issuance of marriage licenses and the performance of marriage in San Francisco. Am I stating that correctly? Yes. Was that that was in the early part of 2004?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Kris Perry: \u003c/strong>Yes. For us, it was February of 2004.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>And what did you did you act on that information?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Kris Perry: \u003c/strong>I did, I, um, I, Sandy and I both were. We’re reading about it in the newspaper, and we talked about whether or not we would want to. I would go to San Francisco to have this, the marriage and then continue with our other plans. And that’s what we decided we want to do. So we made an appointment and we went to City Hall and we brought, um, all of the boys and my mom and we were married in City Hall. A few weeks after our August ceremony, the state Supreme Court ruled that the San Francisco weddings were invalid.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Kris Perry: \u003c/strong>Policy is powerful, and I you internalize that state. You internalize those policies and beliefs into your own psyche. And for me, I really believed I wasn’t as good as heterosexual married people.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Sandy Stier: \u003c/strong>It’s amazing. She’s a really strong person. Professionally, personally and just every way. But to see what that had done to her. To see what living with discrimination had done to her. The painful to know that about. To have to bear witness to that suffering. I had never felt like I wouldn’t have access to marriage. I always thought I would.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Sandy Stier: \u003c/strong>And then when I didn’t have access to marry the person I fell in love with, I was just outraged. I didn’t feel like there was something wrong with me. I thought there was something wrong with the society, with the world, with the process. I thought, this is weird. It’s an absurd thing to to be voted on. And I couldn’t believe, quite frankly, that the majority of my fellow Californians chose to discriminate against me and every other couple or person like me.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Sandy Stier: \u003c/strong>The fact that proposition eight had gone to the voters of California seemed so wrong that people in the in the state could vote on our what we consider to be a fundamental right. Felt like the wrong way to use a political process. And so we felt like maybe it belongs in the judiciary, because do you can you have the majority of the people decide on your rights? That’s not fair. It’s just fundamentally not fair. And as a protected class, we need to have protection. And so with that, like the judicial, you know, the judicial process is where you find protection.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Did you feel that voters were being warned that they needed to protect their children from you?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Kris Perry: \u003c/strong>Yes, I did, and I felt like. I was being used. That my the fact that I, you know, I am the way I am and I can’t change the way I am, was being mocked and made fun of and disparaged in a way that I like that really didn’t have any way to respond to it. I just had to know that people felt that way.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Kris Perry: \u003c/strong>We didn’t make the decision to be plaintiffs without first checking in with the kids, and they each, in their own way, said, this is important. And of course, you should do it if we want you to succeed. And then finally, that we were in a position to do it. We were in a privileged position. We had a secure life, we had good jobs. We had children who were healthy. We had support of the family and friends. And it was we lived in a supportive community. It was it. We should do it.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>What is your relationship with plaintiff Sandra Stier?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Kris Perry: \u003c/strong>Um, well, Sandy is the woman I love.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Kris Perry: \u003c/strong>What happens is you take care of other people’s homophobia. Like, I don’t want to make you feel homophobic, so I’ll be less gay around you. There’s this weird, unspoken dynamic, like you kind of closet yourself. Anyway, so this we we get we gave all that up by being plaintiffs. So we were so obviously out and we cared so much that we weren’t able to play that role anymore. We were just going to be us.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Kris Perry: \u003c/strong>I remember feeling very anxious and, um, scared, honestly not knowing how any of it would turn out, what the questions might be from the other side, how I would hold up if I would get emotional and break down a little bit, and how would I cope with that in the moment? So I was really projecting out about that, not doing a good job and and wanting to be strong. People were really the counting on us to deliver and there was a lot of pressure.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Sandy Stier: \u003c/strong>We did a lot of our trial preparation together in the same room, and that process was grueling. And also, I felt like I learned yet more about Kris and our experiences, and because we had a lot of the preparation together. I think we felt great empathy for each other, you know, for what we’ve gone through. That’s the same as what we’ve gone through. That’s quite different.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Kris Perry: \u003c/strong>We spent quite a bit of time with the lawyers practicing the answers, but more importantly, thinking deeply about our experience as a couple that had been discriminated against. And what did it really mean, and how did it really impact us and our children? So it wasn’t so much the answers as just understanding ourselves.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Being a plaintiff in a case, trying to change the Constitution, is it a burden or is it something that, um, that’s easy for you, um, because of what it means? Tell us about that.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Sandy Stier: \u003c/strong>It doesn’t feel like a burden. It just I feel like a little tiny person in this, this huge country that just. I just want my my rights.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Kris Perry: \u003c/strong>Part of this case was also intended to change public opinion. And that includes our families who live in conservative parts of the state or the country. And one thing we knew, no matter what the outcome of the trial was, was that the public was moving in our direction, that the polling was changing very rapidly, and that included our families. And in the short amount of time we could see them make the shift.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Tell us what it means to you as a plaintiff in this case if you were to be successful. How would change your life?\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Sandy Stier: \u003c/strong>Well, I think it would change my life dramatically. Um, the first time somebody said to me, are you married? And I said, yes, I would think, oh, what? That feels good.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Kris Perry: \u003c/strong>Today is a great day for American children and families. Sandy. And I want to say how happy we are not only to be able to return to California and finally get married, but to be able to say to the children in California, no matter where you live, no matter who you your parents are, no matter what family you’re in. You are equal.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Sandy Stier: \u003c/strong>It felt. I don’t want to say that, great cause that’s an understatement. Yep. It really did change our lives. I more that I think I thought it would.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Kris Perry: \u003c/strong>And the depth of trust and the faith that you’re able to have because you’re not preoccupied with losing it, that you get to actually invest in it. The actual marriage, not in getting married, but being married. Wow. That’s just so different. And that that and I’m still feel grateful for it.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Sandy Stier: \u003c/strong>Words mean something. And I think that was part of the what we learned at trial. Words mean something. They have power. The word marriage means something. And if it didn’t mean something, we wouldn’t want it. And if it didn’t mean something, other people wouldn’t fight to try to keep us from having it.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>That was Kris Perry and Sandy Stier, two plaintiffs in the landmark lawsuit that overturned prop eight. In conversation with KQED, Scott Shafer and Carlos Cabrera-Lomelí This conversation was cut down and edited by producer Maria Esquinca. It was produced and scored by Adhiti Bandlamudi, who also added all the tape.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"ad","attributes":{"named":{"label":"floatright"},"numeric":["floatright"]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cstrong>Ericka Cruz Guevarra: \u003c/strong>The rest of our podcast team here at KQED includes Jen Chien, our director of podcasts, Katie Sprenger, our podcast operations manager, Cesar Saldana, our podcast engagement producer, Maha Sanad, our podcast engagement intern, and Holly Kernan, our chief content officer. And I’m Ericka Cruz Guevarra from me and the entire Bay team. Happy holidays y’all. Take care.\u003c/p>\n\n\u003c/div>\u003c/p>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}}],"link":"/news/11970658/the-couple-who-helped-overturn-californias-same-sex-marriage-ban","authors":["8654","11802","11672"],"categories":["news_8"],"tags":["news_2626","news_126","news_22598"],"featImg":"news_101866","label":"source_news_11970658"},"news_11966077":{"type":"posts","id":"news_11966077","meta":{"index":"posts_1591205157","site":"news","id":"11966077","score":null,"sort":[1701191702000]},"guestAuthors":[],"slug":"inside-the-trial-that-overturned-californias-same-sex-marriage-ban-proposition-8-mike-johnson-lgbtq-rights","title":"Inside the Trial That Overturned California's Same-Sex Marriage Ban","publishDate":1701191702,"format":"standard","headTitle":"Inside the Trial That Overturned California’s Same-Sex Marriage Ban | KQED","labelTerm":{"site":"news"},"content":"\u003cp>\u003c!-- iframe plugin v.4.3 wordpress.org/plugins/iframe/ -->\u003cbr>\n\u003ciframe loading=\"lazy\" frameborder=\"0\" height=\"200\" scrolling=\"no\" src=\"https://playlist.megaphone.fm/?e=KQINC7526943476\" width=\"100%\" class=\"iframe-class\">\u003c/iframe>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>These are some of the ideas promoted by Louisiana Rep. Mike Johnson, the man \u003ca href=\"https://apnews.com/article/house-speaker-republicans-emmer-mccarthy-54352a64be041cd445bda8df28b24f03\">Republicans unanimously elected speaker of the House of Representatives on Oct. 25\u003c/a>, a position second-in-line for the presidency after the vice president:\u003c/p>\n\u003cblockquote>\u003cp>Marriage between two men or two women \u003ca href=\"https://www.newspapers.com/article/the-times-kfile/134019997/\">is not what God intended, and only traditional heterosexual marriage can lead to real happiness\u003c/a>.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Homosexuality \u003ca href=\"https://www.newspapers.com/article/the-times-mike-johnson-2005/134051395/\">is a lifestyle choice, not an immutable characteristic\u003c/a>.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Children are harmed \u003ca href=\"https://www.newspapers.com/article/the-times-kfile/134019997/\">by not having one mother and one father\u003c/a>.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>States \u003ca href=\"https://www.splcenter.org/sites/default/files/adf_-amicusbrief_lawrence_v_texas.pdf\">should be allowed to criminalize consensual sex between two men\u003c/a> as a way to slow the spread of sexually transmitted diseases.\u003c/p>\u003c/blockquote>\n\u003cp>“Experts project that homosexual marriage is the dark harbinger of chaos and sexual anarchy,” Johnson \u003ca href=\"https://www.newspapers.com/article/the-times-kfile/134020593/\">wrote in 2004 in an opinion article\u003c/a> in The Times of Shreveport, Louisiana.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Asked recently by Fox News for his views on homosexuality, Johnson said simply, “Go pick up a Bible. That’s what I believe and so I make no apologies for it.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“That’s why we call him MAGA Mike,” said openly gay Congressman Robert Garcia (D-Long Beach). “He is literally one of the most extreme voices in his party as it relates to LGBTQ rights. And so his record is really troubling.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Many of the ideas espoused by Johnson also served as the ideological basis of \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/tag/proposition-8\">Proposition 8\u003c/a>, the 2008 ballot measure that banned same-sex marriage in California until it was struck down in 2010.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Such constitutional amendments, Johnson said, “are the people’s only way to prevent same-sex marriage as demanded by activist courts.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The rise of Johnson to the speakership coincides with renewed ultraconservative activism under the guise of keeping public policy from getting in between parents and their children.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>At school board meetings, city councils and state legislatures around the country — \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11965684/amidst-backlash-conservative-groups-target-south-bay-school-board-seats\">including in the Bay Area\u003c/a> — conservative activists led by organizations such as \u003ca href=\"https://www.momsforliberty.org/\">Moms for Liberty\u003c/a> are using “parental rights” as a cry to stir up anger against policies supporting transgender youth and their families.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad fullwidth]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The notion that children need protection from predatory queer people or their allies is nothing new. In the 1970s, former beauty pageant winner \u003ca href=\"https://www.nbcnews.com/nbc-out/out-news/1970s-christian-crusader-anita-bryant-helped-spawn-floridas-lgbtq-cult-rcna24215\">Anita Bryant used it to roll back gay rights ordinances in Florida\u003c/a>. Here in California in 1978, \u003ca href=\"https://www.latimes.com/opinion/story/2021-08-04/gearhart-briggs-initiative-ban-gay-teachers-proposition-6\">it was the misguided rationale behind the so-called Briggs Initiative\u003c/a>, which sought to prevent openly gay and lesbian people from teaching in K-12 schools. Voters soundly defeated it.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>But that was not the case 15 years ago, on Nov. 4, 2008 — when Proposition 8 passed. It was a night when Californians overwhelmingly voted to elect Barack Obama president while simultaneously taking away the right of same-sex couples to marry. For LGBTQ+ voters, it was political whiplash — euphoria and despair in one night.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Proposition 8 passed with 52% of the vote, eliminating a right that had been granted to gay and lesbian couples by the California Supreme Court less than six months earlier.\u003c/p>\n\u003ch2>Anti-gay tropes on trial\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>As it happens, the ideas embraced by Speaker Johnson and supporters of Proposition 8 were all put on trial in 2010 after two same-sex couples sued in federal court to overturn the measure when they were denied marriage licenses.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>That Proposition 8 trial — which included expert witnesses testifying under oath about anti-gay tropes, theories and political arguments — resulted in Proposition 8 being struck down in 2010 when the federal trial judge deemed the evidence against same-sex marriage to be uncompelling and ruled that the law violated the Due Process and Equal Protection clauses of the 14th Amendment to the U.S. Constitution. The Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals upheld the ruling, and the legal battle ended when the U.S. Supreme Court declined to take up a final appeal in 2013.[aside postID=\"news_11911275\" hero=\"https://ww2.kqed.org/app/uploads/sites/10/2023/04/RS5337_KQEDprop8castro_01.jpg\"]For more than a decade after it ended, videotapes of the trial were under seal until KQED fought a long legal battle to make them available to the public. The U.S. Supreme Court \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11911275/supreme-court-ruling-clears-way-for-release-of-footage-from-landmark-trial-that-legalized-same-sex-marriage-in-california\">allowed them to be unsealed in October 2022\u003c/a>.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>After the videotapes were released, KQED invited the four Proposition 8 plaintiffs — Kris Perry and Sandy Stier along with Paul Katami and Jeffrey Zarrillo — to view them for the first time and talk about the trial, its aftermath and its significance today.\u003c/p>\n\u003ch2>‘The lie won people over, and the lie was based on fear’\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>One thing that stood out is that the ‘Yes on 8’ messages still echo today.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Leaders in the Catholic and Mormon Churches promoted the campaign to ban same-sex marriages in California. Among the ‘Yes on 8’ slogans: “Protect the Children.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“The sad part of it is, that campaign worked because the convenience of the lie won people over, and the lie was based on fear,” recalls Paul Katami. “And that fear included children. So I would never say it was a brilliant tactic, but it was an evil tactic.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>Watch a video featuring Paul Katami and Jeffrey Zarrillo reflecting on their experiences, produced by KQED’s \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/author/ccabreralomeli\">Carlos Cabrera-Lomelí\u003c/a>.\u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CGFgrXJx950\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Attorney Thomas R. Burke led KQED’s successful legal battle to unseal the tapes. He said the trial tested the homophobic, hateful arguments promoted by Proposition 8 supporters. The witnesses, the withering cross-examinations and the poignant testimony are all caught on \u003ca href=\"https://cand.uscourts.gov/notices/video-recordings-of-perry-v-schwarzenegger-now-available/\">video that is now available to anyone who wants to watch\u003c/a>.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“The evidence didn’t support you,” Burke said, referring to ‘Yes on 8’ defenders. “You had great lawyers arguing your cause, and you didn’t win. And if people thought you should have won, they can see and judge for themselves. If you didn’t have that recorded, that couldn’t happen.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The historic trial resulted in a landmark decision when Judge Vaughn Walker struck down the ballot measure, ruling it violated the U.S. Constitution — but it was hardly a foregone conclusion at the start.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[pullquote size=\"medium\" align=\"right\" citation=\"Jeffrey Zarrillo, Proposition 8 plaintiff\"]‘I said to Paul at one point, ‘Even if we lose, we can go to our graves knowing that we didn’t stand for being treated as second-class citizens. We tried to do something about it.”[/pullquote]“I remember feeling very anxious and scared, honestly, not knowing how any of it would turn out,” lead plaintiff Kris Perry said after viewing trial clips at KQED. “People were really, you know, counting on us to deliver. And there was a lot of pressure.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Perry’s wife, Sandy Stier, recalls what seemed like days and days of preparation before going on the stand. She remembers worrying about how the trial might affect their lives, “not only for me, what it might be like for my kids, for my parents, my siblings and my community. And so it was very, very anxious going into court that day, not knowing.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Zarrillo and Katami were the first witnesses called to testify.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“I had so many fears going into the trial,” Katami said. “I was not confident because this was uncharted territory for both of us as human beings.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“I said to Paul at one point, ‘Even if we lose, we can go to our graves knowing that we didn’t stand for being treated as second-class citizens,’” Zarrillo said. “We tried to do something about it.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The trial was originally going to be televised on closed circuit TV via YouTube until Proposition 8 attorneys objected, and the U.S. Supreme Court intervened to prevent it. But Judge Walker recorded the trial anyway, he said, for his personal use in writing the decision.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>On the stand, Katami was asked by one of their attorneys, David Boies, what the big deal was about not being able to marry when they had the option of a domestic partnership.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“The big deal is it’s creating a separate category for us. And that’s a major deal because it makes you into a second-, third- … and fourth-class citizen,” Katami said that day in January 2010.\u003c/p>\n\u003cfigure id=\"attachment_11966192\" class=\"wp-caption aligncenter\" style=\"max-width: 2000px\">\u003cimg loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"size-full wp-image-11966192\" src=\"https://ww2.kqed.org/app/uploads/sites/10/2023/11/03032023_prop9lawsuit-469-KQED.jpg\" alt=\"Two people sit next to each other in chairs in front of a white backdrop.\" width=\"2000\" height=\"1331\" srcset=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2023/11/03032023_prop9lawsuit-469-KQED.jpg 2000w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2023/11/03032023_prop9lawsuit-469-KQED-800x532.jpg 800w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2023/11/03032023_prop9lawsuit-469-KQED-1020x679.jpg 1020w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2023/11/03032023_prop9lawsuit-469-KQED-160x106.jpg 160w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2023/11/03032023_prop9lawsuit-469-KQED-1536x1022.jpg 1536w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2023/11/03032023_prop9lawsuit-469-KQED-1920x1278.jpg 1920w\" sizes=\"(max-width: 2000px) 100vw, 2000px\">\u003cfigcaption class=\"wp-caption-text\">Jeffrey Zarrillo, left, and Paul Katami, plaintiffs in the landmark lawsuit that overturned California’s ban on same-sex marriage, sit during an interview at the KQED offices in San Francisco on March 3, 2023. Katami and Zarrillo had come to the studio to watch clips of their testimony in federal court, which KQED had fought to get unsealed. \u003ccite>(Kori Suzuki/KQED)\u003c/cite>\u003c/figcaption>\u003c/figure>\n\u003cp>Concerns over renewed efforts to make LGBTQ+ people second-class citizens were shared by none other than U.S. Supreme Court Justice Sonia Sotomayor this summer, following the high court’s ruling siding with a Christian graphic artist who refused to work with same-sex couples. \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11955680/explaining-303-creative-decision\">Sotomayor wrote in her dissent that the decision’s effect was to “mark gays and lesbians for second-class status”\u003c/a> and that the ruling opened the door to further discrimination.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Reflecting on his testimony, Katami said until the Proposition 8 trial, many heterosexuals didn’t know the hundreds of rights automatically afforded straight couples — but denied to LGBTQ people.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“And if you don’t have that protection because marriage allows that protection, there’s a bright spotlight that shines down on those rights when you don’t have them,” Katami says.[aside postID=\"news_11955680\" hero=\"https://ww2.kqed.org/app/uploads/sites/10/2023/07/GettyImages-180517172-1020x680.jpg\"]Viewing the trial tapes, Zarrillo noted that “when you’re on the stand like that, you have to really figure out, how do I answer this question [in a way] that is not going to hurt our cause?” he said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>When Perry was asked in court to describe her relationship with Stier, whom she met while both were students at UC Santa Cruz, Perry testified, “I met Sandy thinking she was maybe the sparkliest person I ever met. And I wanted to be her friend.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>On the stand, Stier testified that after meeting Perry, she “ really felt like the thunderbolt of change for me.” Unlike Perry, Stier wasn’t an out lesbian at the time.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“I had moved to California, got married to a man, had two kids, and knew that something wasn’t working for me,” Stier told KQED.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>Watch a video featuring Kris Perry and Sandy Stier reflecting on their experiences, produced by KQED’s \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/author/ccabreralomeli\">Carlos Cabrera-Lomelí\u003c/a>.\u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gMlRY1EIifk\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The trial tapes reveal the humanity of the issue, ably presented by the four plaintiffs, Judge Walker said recently.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“Both of the couples were very able witnesses — very attractive witnesses… So, we’re talking about matters that are intensely personal and important to them. That’s pretty compelling testimony under any circumstances,” Walker told KQED.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>But the audible and visible emotion of their testimony was out of view until the trial tapes were unsealed.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Of course, unlike TV shows, where every courtroom scene is riveting and entertaining, real-life trials are mostly “hours and hours of tedium broken episodically by sometimes emotions (or) events of great interest. But they are few and far between,” Walker said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Still, the retired judge said the tapes will be helpful in law schools to show students how courts deal with “a social issue or a constitutional issue of widespread importance.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[pullquote size=\"medium\" align=\"right\" citation=\"Honey Mahogany, transgender rights activist and chair of the San Francisco Democratic Central Committee \"]‘Seeing what happened during the trial behind the scenes is really important because it helps expose the truth. It helps expose the fact that this is just about two people loving each other.’[/pullquote]After Proposition 8 was struck down, both couples soon married and remain so today. But LGBTQ people are still under attack by people hoping to use them as political fodder on behalf of conservative causes.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“I think that is incredibly dangerous,” transgender rights activist Honey Mahogany said. “These are tropes that have always been a part of emotionally manipulating people to advantage a certain political group or cause, right? They’re not based in fact.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Mahogany, who also chairs the San Francisco Democratic Central Committee, said the release of the trial tapes helps to humanize issues and the plaintiffs.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“Seeing what happened during the trial behind the scenes is really important because it helps expose the truth,” Mahogany said. “It helps expose the fact that this is just about two people loving each other, wanting to cement their relationship, wanting to protect each other … and their children.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Mahogany said that given the risks of failure, what the Proposition 8 plaintiffs did was “incredibly important and brave.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>She hopes their example will encourage others to come forward today to humanize LGBTQ issues. “We can learn from history. We can, you know, find our champions and also our storytellers to help us tell our stories,” Mahogany said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>With the videotapes now accessible online, their stories told under oath can be seen by anyone who wishes to watch.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“They fought for a decade that this would not be seen,” Burke said. “And I think there’s a reason for that,” Burke said, implying their arguments simply didn’t hold up under legal scrutiny.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Although Walker’s ruling striking down Proposition 8 was upheld by the U.S. Supreme Court, the measure’s wording remains in the California Constitution. But voters will have the chance to change that next November. The State Legislature\u003ca href=\"https://ballotpedia.org/California_Right_to_Marry_and_Repeal_Proposition_8_Amendment_(2024)\"> placed a measure on the fall 2024 ballot that removes that invalidated language\u003c/a> and replaces it with an affirmation of the right of all couples to marry in California.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>A version of this story was originally published on Nov. 2.\u003c/em>\u003cbr>\n[ad fullwidth]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad floatright]\u003c/p>\n","blocks":[],"excerpt":"Much of today's anti-LGBTQ rhetoric – including from new House Speaker Mike Johnson – was also behind Prop. 8, the 2008 ballot measure that banned same-sex marriage in California. We talk with the plaintiffs whose lawsuit culminated in a judge striking down Prop. 8 – and look back on trial video, now available for the very first time.","status":"publish","parent":0,"modified":1703286378,"stats":{"hasAudio":true,"hasVideo":true,"hasChartOrMap":false,"iframeSrcs":[],"hasGoogleForm":false,"hasGallery":false,"hasHearkenModule":false,"hasPolis":false,"paragraphCount":58,"wordCount":2408},"headData":{"title":"Inside the Trial That Overturned California's Same-Sex Marriage Ban | KQED","description":"Much of today's anti-LGBTQ rhetoric – including from new House Speaker Mike Johnson – was also behind Prop. 8, the 2008 ballot measure that banned same-sex marriage in California. We talk with the plaintiffs whose lawsuit culminated in a judge striking down Prop. 8 – and look back on trial video, now available for the very first time.","ogTitle":"","ogDescription":"","ogImgId":"","twTitle":"","twDescription":"","twImgId":"","schema":{"@context":"http://schema.org","@type":"NewsArticle","headline":"Inside the Trial That Overturned California's Same-Sex Marriage Ban","datePublished":"2023-11-28T17:15:02.000Z","dateModified":"2023-12-22T23:06:18.000Z","image":"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/KQED-OG-Image@1x.png","isAccessibleForFree":"Y","publisher":{"@type":"NewsMediaOrganization","@id":"https://www.kqed.org/#organization","name":"KQED","url":"https://www.kqed.org","logo":"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/KQED-OG-Image@1x.png"}}},"audioUrl":"https://traffic.omny.fm/d/clips/0af137ef-751e-4b19-a055-aaef00d2d578/ffca7e9f-6831-41c5-bcaf-aaef00f5a073/06257420-e16c-4c8d-b757-b0ae010b178d/audio.mp3","sticky":false,"excludeFromSiteSearch":"Include","articleAge":"0","path":"/news/11966077/inside-the-trial-that-overturned-californias-same-sex-marriage-ban-proposition-8-mike-johnson-lgbtq-rights","audioTrackLength":null,"parsedContent":[{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003cp>\u003c!-- iframe plugin v.4.3 wordpress.org/plugins/iframe/ -->\u003cbr>\n\u003ciframe loading=\"lazy\" frameborder=\"0\" height=\"200\" scrolling=\"no\" src=\"https://playlist.megaphone.fm/?e=KQINC7526943476\" width=\"100%\" class=\"iframe-class\">\u003c/iframe>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>These are some of the ideas promoted by Louisiana Rep. Mike Johnson, the man \u003ca href=\"https://apnews.com/article/house-speaker-republicans-emmer-mccarthy-54352a64be041cd445bda8df28b24f03\">Republicans unanimously elected speaker of the House of Representatives on Oct. 25\u003c/a>, a position second-in-line for the presidency after the vice president:\u003c/p>\n\u003cblockquote>\u003cp>Marriage between two men or two women \u003ca href=\"https://www.newspapers.com/article/the-times-kfile/134019997/\">is not what God intended, and only traditional heterosexual marriage can lead to real happiness\u003c/a>.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Homosexuality \u003ca href=\"https://www.newspapers.com/article/the-times-mike-johnson-2005/134051395/\">is a lifestyle choice, not an immutable characteristic\u003c/a>.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Children are harmed \u003ca href=\"https://www.newspapers.com/article/the-times-kfile/134019997/\">by not having one mother and one father\u003c/a>.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>States \u003ca href=\"https://www.splcenter.org/sites/default/files/adf_-amicusbrief_lawrence_v_texas.pdf\">should be allowed to criminalize consensual sex between two men\u003c/a> as a way to slow the spread of sexually transmitted diseases.\u003c/p>\u003c/blockquote>\n\u003cp>“Experts project that homosexual marriage is the dark harbinger of chaos and sexual anarchy,” Johnson \u003ca href=\"https://www.newspapers.com/article/the-times-kfile/134020593/\">wrote in 2004 in an opinion article\u003c/a> in The Times of Shreveport, Louisiana.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Asked recently by Fox News for his views on homosexuality, Johnson said simply, “Go pick up a Bible. That’s what I believe and so I make no apologies for it.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“That’s why we call him MAGA Mike,” said openly gay Congressman Robert Garcia (D-Long Beach). “He is literally one of the most extreme voices in his party as it relates to LGBTQ rights. And so his record is really troubling.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Many of the ideas espoused by Johnson also served as the ideological basis of \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/tag/proposition-8\">Proposition 8\u003c/a>, the 2008 ballot measure that banned same-sex marriage in California until it was struck down in 2010.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Such constitutional amendments, Johnson said, “are the people’s only way to prevent same-sex marriage as demanded by activist courts.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The rise of Johnson to the speakership coincides with renewed ultraconservative activism under the guise of keeping public policy from getting in between parents and their children.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>At school board meetings, city councils and state legislatures around the country — \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11965684/amidst-backlash-conservative-groups-target-south-bay-school-board-seats\">including in the Bay Area\u003c/a> — conservative activists led by organizations such as \u003ca href=\"https://www.momsforliberty.org/\">Moms for Liberty\u003c/a> are using “parental rights” as a cry to stir up anger against policies supporting transgender youth and their families.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"ad","attributes":{"named":{"label":"fullwidth"},"numeric":["fullwidth"]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The notion that children need protection from predatory queer people or their allies is nothing new. In the 1970s, former beauty pageant winner \u003ca href=\"https://www.nbcnews.com/nbc-out/out-news/1970s-christian-crusader-anita-bryant-helped-spawn-floridas-lgbtq-cult-rcna24215\">Anita Bryant used it to roll back gay rights ordinances in Florida\u003c/a>. Here in California in 1978, \u003ca href=\"https://www.latimes.com/opinion/story/2021-08-04/gearhart-briggs-initiative-ban-gay-teachers-proposition-6\">it was the misguided rationale behind the so-called Briggs Initiative\u003c/a>, which sought to prevent openly gay and lesbian people from teaching in K-12 schools. Voters soundly defeated it.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>But that was not the case 15 years ago, on Nov. 4, 2008 — when Proposition 8 passed. It was a night when Californians overwhelmingly voted to elect Barack Obama president while simultaneously taking away the right of same-sex couples to marry. For LGBTQ+ voters, it was political whiplash — euphoria and despair in one night.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Proposition 8 passed with 52% of the vote, eliminating a right that had been granted to gay and lesbian couples by the California Supreme Court less than six months earlier.\u003c/p>\n\u003ch2>Anti-gay tropes on trial\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>As it happens, the ideas embraced by Speaker Johnson and supporters of Proposition 8 were all put on trial in 2010 after two same-sex couples sued in federal court to overturn the measure when they were denied marriage licenses.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>That Proposition 8 trial — which included expert witnesses testifying under oath about anti-gay tropes, theories and political arguments — resulted in Proposition 8 being struck down in 2010 when the federal trial judge deemed the evidence against same-sex marriage to be uncompelling and ruled that the law violated the Due Process and Equal Protection clauses of the 14th Amendment to the U.S. Constitution. The Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals upheld the ruling, and the legal battle ended when the U.S. Supreme Court declined to take up a final appeal in 2013.\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"aside","attributes":{"named":{"postid":"news_11911275","hero":"https://ww2.kqed.org/app/uploads/sites/10/2023/04/RS5337_KQEDprop8castro_01.jpg","label":""},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>For more than a decade after it ended, videotapes of the trial were under seal until KQED fought a long legal battle to make them available to the public. The U.S. Supreme Court \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11911275/supreme-court-ruling-clears-way-for-release-of-footage-from-landmark-trial-that-legalized-same-sex-marriage-in-california\">allowed them to be unsealed in October 2022\u003c/a>.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>After the videotapes were released, KQED invited the four Proposition 8 plaintiffs — Kris Perry and Sandy Stier along with Paul Katami and Jeffrey Zarrillo — to view them for the first time and talk about the trial, its aftermath and its significance today.\u003c/p>\n\u003ch2>‘The lie won people over, and the lie was based on fear’\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>One thing that stood out is that the ‘Yes on 8’ messages still echo today.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Leaders in the Catholic and Mormon Churches promoted the campaign to ban same-sex marriages in California. Among the ‘Yes on 8’ slogans: “Protect the Children.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“The sad part of it is, that campaign worked because the convenience of the lie won people over, and the lie was based on fear,” recalls Paul Katami. “And that fear included children. So I would never say it was a brilliant tactic, but it was an evil tactic.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>Watch a video featuring Paul Katami and Jeffrey Zarrillo reflecting on their experiences, produced by KQED’s \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/author/ccabreralomeli\">Carlos Cabrera-Lomelí\u003c/a>.\u003c/em>\u003c/p>\u003c/p>\u003cp>\u003cspan class='utils-parseShortcode-shortcodes-__youtubeShortcode__embedYoutube'>\n \u003cspan class='utils-parseShortcode-shortcodes-__youtubeShortcode__embedYoutubeInside'>\n \u003ciframe\n loading='lazy'\n class='utils-parseShortcode-shortcodes-__youtubeShortcode__youtubePlayer'\n type='text/html'\n src='//www.youtube.com/embed/CGFgrXJx950'\n title='//www.youtube.com/embed/CGFgrXJx950'\n allowfullscreen='true'\n style='border:0;'>\u003c/iframe>\n \u003c/span>\n \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\u003cp>\u003cp>Attorney Thomas R. Burke led KQED’s successful legal battle to unseal the tapes. He said the trial tested the homophobic, hateful arguments promoted by Proposition 8 supporters. The witnesses, the withering cross-examinations and the poignant testimony are all caught on \u003ca href=\"https://cand.uscourts.gov/notices/video-recordings-of-perry-v-schwarzenegger-now-available/\">video that is now available to anyone who wants to watch\u003c/a>.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“The evidence didn’t support you,” Burke said, referring to ‘Yes on 8’ defenders. “You had great lawyers arguing your cause, and you didn’t win. And if people thought you should have won, they can see and judge for themselves. If you didn’t have that recorded, that couldn’t happen.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The historic trial resulted in a landmark decision when Judge Vaughn Walker struck down the ballot measure, ruling it violated the U.S. Constitution — but it was hardly a foregone conclusion at the start.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"‘I said to Paul at one point, ‘Even if we lose, we can go to our graves knowing that we didn’t stand for being treated as second-class citizens. We tried to do something about it.”","name":"pullquote","attributes":{"named":{"size":"medium","align":"right","citation":"Jeffrey Zarrillo, Proposition 8 plaintiff","label":""},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>“I remember feeling very anxious and scared, honestly, not knowing how any of it would turn out,” lead plaintiff Kris Perry said after viewing trial clips at KQED. “People were really, you know, counting on us to deliver. And there was a lot of pressure.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Perry’s wife, Sandy Stier, recalls what seemed like days and days of preparation before going on the stand. She remembers worrying about how the trial might affect their lives, “not only for me, what it might be like for my kids, for my parents, my siblings and my community. And so it was very, very anxious going into court that day, not knowing.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Zarrillo and Katami were the first witnesses called to testify.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“I had so many fears going into the trial,” Katami said. “I was not confident because this was uncharted territory for both of us as human beings.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“I said to Paul at one point, ‘Even if we lose, we can go to our graves knowing that we didn’t stand for being treated as second-class citizens,’” Zarrillo said. “We tried to do something about it.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The trial was originally going to be televised on closed circuit TV via YouTube until Proposition 8 attorneys objected, and the U.S. Supreme Court intervened to prevent it. But Judge Walker recorded the trial anyway, he said, for his personal use in writing the decision.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>On the stand, Katami was asked by one of their attorneys, David Boies, what the big deal was about not being able to marry when they had the option of a domestic partnership.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“The big deal is it’s creating a separate category for us. And that’s a major deal because it makes you into a second-, third- … and fourth-class citizen,” Katami said that day in January 2010.\u003c/p>\n\u003cfigure id=\"attachment_11966192\" class=\"wp-caption aligncenter\" style=\"max-width: 2000px\">\u003cimg loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"size-full wp-image-11966192\" src=\"https://ww2.kqed.org/app/uploads/sites/10/2023/11/03032023_prop9lawsuit-469-KQED.jpg\" alt=\"Two people sit next to each other in chairs in front of a white backdrop.\" width=\"2000\" height=\"1331\" srcset=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2023/11/03032023_prop9lawsuit-469-KQED.jpg 2000w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2023/11/03032023_prop9lawsuit-469-KQED-800x532.jpg 800w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2023/11/03032023_prop9lawsuit-469-KQED-1020x679.jpg 1020w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2023/11/03032023_prop9lawsuit-469-KQED-160x106.jpg 160w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2023/11/03032023_prop9lawsuit-469-KQED-1536x1022.jpg 1536w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2023/11/03032023_prop9lawsuit-469-KQED-1920x1278.jpg 1920w\" sizes=\"(max-width: 2000px) 100vw, 2000px\">\u003cfigcaption class=\"wp-caption-text\">Jeffrey Zarrillo, left, and Paul Katami, plaintiffs in the landmark lawsuit that overturned California’s ban on same-sex marriage, sit during an interview at the KQED offices in San Francisco on March 3, 2023. Katami and Zarrillo had come to the studio to watch clips of their testimony in federal court, which KQED had fought to get unsealed. \u003ccite>(Kori Suzuki/KQED)\u003c/cite>\u003c/figcaption>\u003c/figure>\n\u003cp>Concerns over renewed efforts to make LGBTQ+ people second-class citizens were shared by none other than U.S. Supreme Court Justice Sonia Sotomayor this summer, following the high court’s ruling siding with a Christian graphic artist who refused to work with same-sex couples. \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11955680/explaining-303-creative-decision\">Sotomayor wrote in her dissent that the decision’s effect was to “mark gays and lesbians for second-class status”\u003c/a> and that the ruling opened the door to further discrimination.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Reflecting on his testimony, Katami said until the Proposition 8 trial, many heterosexuals didn’t know the hundreds of rights automatically afforded straight couples — but denied to LGBTQ people.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“And if you don’t have that protection because marriage allows that protection, there’s a bright spotlight that shines down on those rights when you don’t have them,” Katami says.\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"aside","attributes":{"named":{"postid":"news_11955680","hero":"https://ww2.kqed.org/app/uploads/sites/10/2023/07/GettyImages-180517172-1020x680.jpg","label":""},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>Viewing the trial tapes, Zarrillo noted that “when you’re on the stand like that, you have to really figure out, how do I answer this question [in a way] that is not going to hurt our cause?” he said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>When Perry was asked in court to describe her relationship with Stier, whom she met while both were students at UC Santa Cruz, Perry testified, “I met Sandy thinking she was maybe the sparkliest person I ever met. And I wanted to be her friend.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>On the stand, Stier testified that after meeting Perry, she “ really felt like the thunderbolt of change for me.” Unlike Perry, Stier wasn’t an out lesbian at the time.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“I had moved to California, got married to a man, had two kids, and knew that something wasn’t working for me,” Stier told KQED.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>Watch a video featuring Kris Perry and Sandy Stier reflecting on their experiences, produced by KQED’s \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/author/ccabreralomeli\">Carlos Cabrera-Lomelí\u003c/a>.\u003c/em>\u003c/p>\u003c/p>\u003cp>\u003cspan class='utils-parseShortcode-shortcodes-__youtubeShortcode__embedYoutube'>\n \u003cspan class='utils-parseShortcode-shortcodes-__youtubeShortcode__embedYoutubeInside'>\n \u003ciframe\n loading='lazy'\n class='utils-parseShortcode-shortcodes-__youtubeShortcode__youtubePlayer'\n type='text/html'\n src='//www.youtube.com/embed/gMlRY1EIifk'\n title='//www.youtube.com/embed/gMlRY1EIifk'\n allowfullscreen='true'\n style='border:0;'>\u003c/iframe>\n \u003c/span>\n \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\u003cp>\u003cp>The trial tapes reveal the humanity of the issue, ably presented by the four plaintiffs, Judge Walker said recently.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“Both of the couples were very able witnesses — very attractive witnesses… So, we’re talking about matters that are intensely personal and important to them. That’s pretty compelling testimony under any circumstances,” Walker told KQED.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>But the audible and visible emotion of their testimony was out of view until the trial tapes were unsealed.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Of course, unlike TV shows, where every courtroom scene is riveting and entertaining, real-life trials are mostly “hours and hours of tedium broken episodically by sometimes emotions (or) events of great interest. But they are few and far between,” Walker said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Still, the retired judge said the tapes will be helpful in law schools to show students how courts deal with “a social issue or a constitutional issue of widespread importance.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"‘Seeing what happened during the trial behind the scenes is really important because it helps expose the truth. It helps expose the fact that this is just about two people loving each other.’","name":"pullquote","attributes":{"named":{"size":"medium","align":"right","citation":"Honey Mahogany, transgender rights activist and chair of the San Francisco Democratic Central Committee ","label":""},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>After Proposition 8 was struck down, both couples soon married and remain so today. But LGBTQ people are still under attack by people hoping to use them as political fodder on behalf of conservative causes.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“I think that is incredibly dangerous,” transgender rights activist Honey Mahogany said. “These are tropes that have always been a part of emotionally manipulating people to advantage a certain political group or cause, right? They’re not based in fact.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Mahogany, who also chairs the San Francisco Democratic Central Committee, said the release of the trial tapes helps to humanize issues and the plaintiffs.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“Seeing what happened during the trial behind the scenes is really important because it helps expose the truth,” Mahogany said. “It helps expose the fact that this is just about two people loving each other, wanting to cement their relationship, wanting to protect each other … and their children.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Mahogany said that given the risks of failure, what the Proposition 8 plaintiffs did was “incredibly important and brave.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>She hopes their example will encourage others to come forward today to humanize LGBTQ issues. “We can learn from history. We can, you know, find our champions and also our storytellers to help us tell our stories,” Mahogany said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>With the videotapes now accessible online, their stories told under oath can be seen by anyone who wishes to watch.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“They fought for a decade that this would not be seen,” Burke said. “And I think there’s a reason for that,” Burke said, implying their arguments simply didn’t hold up under legal scrutiny.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Although Walker’s ruling striking down Proposition 8 was upheld by the U.S. Supreme Court, the measure’s wording remains in the California Constitution. But voters will have the chance to change that next November. The State Legislature\u003ca href=\"https://ballotpedia.org/California_Right_to_Marry_and_Repeal_Proposition_8_Amendment_(2024)\"> placed a measure on the fall 2024 ballot that removes that invalidated language\u003c/a> and replaces it with an affirmation of the right of all couples to marry in California.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>A version of this story was originally published on Nov. 2.\u003c/em>\u003cbr>\n\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"ad","attributes":{"named":{"label":"fullwidth"},"numeric":["fullwidth"]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"ad","attributes":{"named":{"label":"floatright"},"numeric":["floatright"]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003c/div>\u003c/p>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}}],"link":"/news/11966077/inside-the-trial-that-overturned-californias-same-sex-marriage-ban-proposition-8-mike-johnson-lgbtq-rights","authors":["255"],"categories":["news_8","news_13"],"tags":["news_30811","news_27626","news_20004","news_19345","news_33426","news_17968","news_126","news_322"],"featImg":"news_11966190","label":"news"},"news_11911275":{"type":"posts","id":"news_11911275","meta":{"index":"posts_1591205157","site":"news","id":"11911275","score":null,"sort":[1665496035000]},"guestAuthors":[],"slug":"supreme-court-ruling-clears-way-for-release-of-footage-from-landmark-trial-that-legalized-same-sex-marriage-in-california","title":"Supreme Court Clears Way for Release of Footage From Landmark Trial That Legalized Same-Sex Marriage in California","publishDate":1665496035,"format":"standard","headTitle":"KQED News","labelTerm":{"site":"news"},"content":"\u003cp>KQED scored a historic legal victory Tuesday when the U.S. Supreme Court declined to consider an effort to block the release of videotapes from the 2010 federal trial in San Francisco that ultimately led to the legalization of same-sex marriage in California.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Tuesday's decision is the culmination of a 12-year legal effort that began in 2009 when a media coalition led by KQED sought to have the trial broadcast. In 2017 KQED asked the Northern District of California to unseal the trial tapes, arguing that the recordings were a vital part of the public record in a historic legal case. While the court did not agree to immediately release the tapes, it ordered them to be unsealed on Aug. 12, 2020 — 10 years after the case closed. In declining to hear an appeal of lower court rulings, the Supreme Court effectively cleared the way for the tapes to be released.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“After today’s ruling by the U.S. Supreme Court, the public will finally be able to watch the testimony that Judge Vaughn Walker considered in deciding that same-sex couples have the right to marry,\" said Thomas R. Burke, KQED's attorney. \"There’s no doubt that the video will become a valuable instrument to educate the public about this historic moment.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\"Great news! Love wins again and now, so does transparency,\" said Jeff Zarillo, one of the original plaintiffs in the case.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Holly Kernan, KQED's chief content officer, agreed. \"If our systems work behind closed doors, with no press or public access, we have no idea how decisions are made, nor what arguments are leading to these decisions,\" she said. \"KQED wants more sunlight on our legal system and we will fight on behalf of the public to get that access.\" \u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[aside postID=\"news_11919970,news_11922040\" label=\"Related Posts\"]Supporters of Proposition 8 – a California ballot proposition passed by voters in 2008 that would have banned same-sex marriage in the state – previously appealed to the 9th Circuit Court of Appeals, seeking to have the tapes sealed permanently.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>That court dismissed that request, saying the petitioners lacked legal standing for their appeal. The court also batted away the contention that unsealing the tapes would lead to harm or harassment of anyone directly involved in the trial and confirmed the lower court’s decision to unseal the tapes.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>In a last-ditch effort to keep the tapes sealed, Proposition 8 proponents asked the Supreme Court to take up the case. In their \u003ca href=\"https://www.supremecourt.gov/DocketPDF/21/21-1304/219553/20220328101818830_Hollingsworth%20v.%20Perry%20Petition.pdf\">March 28, 2022 petition\u003c/a>, attorneys for Proposition 8 said the court's intervention was needed to \"prevent a grievous injury\" to the ballot measure's backers and to \"the integrity of the federal judiciary.\"\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>This entire issue began over 12 years ago, when Judge Vaughn R. Walker, the federal court judge who presided over the 2010 Perry v. Schwarzenegger trial, announced that he wanted the entire proceeding to be broadcast live via closed-circuit television with viewing in federal courthouses in San Francisco, Pasadena, Seattle and Portland, Oregon.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>That would have made Perry v. Schwarzenegger the first federal trial to be broadcast and recorded, with videotapes to be made available for later viewing on YouTube.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>But the Proposition 8 defense team objected as the bench trial was starting and the Supreme Court intervened, stopping the live broadcast before it began. The court said Walker failed to go through the appropriate process for getting approval for such a broadcast.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Over objections from Proposition 8 attorneys, Walker said he would videotape the trial anyway for personal use in his chambers to help him write the decision, which ultimately struck down Proposition 8.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Responding to the Supreme Court's refusal to take up the case and allow the lower court rulings to stand, Walker, who is now retired from the bench, said the justices did the right thing.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\"With everything else going on in the world, not weighing in on this issue was an easy decision,\" said Walker. He added that the format of the Prop. 8 trial, with its expert witnesses providing testimony about the history, economics, sociology and psychology of gender roles and same-sex marriage could be a blueprint for judges in other controversial issues, including abortion.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\"It was testimony by people who understood the whole panoply which gender plays in our society and in personal relationships,\" Walker said. \"Trials reveal things that simply cannot come out when you're scratching through old dusty books and records of the long past. And I think there are going to be many enactments affecting the abortion rights in the various states in the wake of the Dobbs decision.\"\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad fullwidth]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>In seeking to block release of the videotapes, attorneys for the ballot measure's proponents argued to the Supreme Court that Walker \"solemnly promised\" in court that the tapes would not be made public, and that doing so now would undermine public faith in the courts.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>In a \u003ca href=\"https://www.supremecourt.gov/DocketPDF/21/21-1304/226576/20220531111532780_Hollingsworth%20v.%20Perry%20--%20Brief%20in%20Opp.pdf\">response brief (PDF)\u003c/a>, attorneys for KQED argued that there was never a promise to keep the trial tapes sealed beyond 10 years and that Proposition 8 supporters failed to demonstrate any concrete injury that would come from releasing them.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Kris Perry, one of the original plaintiffs along with her partner Sandy Stier, said release of the tapes was long overdue.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\"Since the 2010 ruling striking down Proposition 8, we have fought to have the video record of our historic trial shared with the public,\" Perry said. \"There is no more important time to expose the discriminatory rhetoric of proponents and the courage of the experts, attorneys and plaintiffs in standing up against hate. Even though it's been 12 years since our ruling, we know the fight for marriage equality and many other basic civil rights is still essential and this video shows the evidence for why.\"\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The 2009 lawsuit filed by supporters of same-sex marriage against Proposition 8 was considered risky by some progressive legal groups, which worried that a setback in federal court could take decades to undo.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The trial gained national attention, in part because the legal team seeking to have Proposition 8 struck down was led by conservative Theodore Olson and liberal David Boies, who were on \u003cem>opposite\u003c/em> sides of the infamous Bush v. Gore case following the disputed 2000 presidential election.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The three-week trial in 2010 considered a wide range of issues, including the history of marriage, the political power of the LGBTQ+ community, the social and psychological harm of so-called \"conversion therapy\" and how the plaintiffs and their children were personally affected by being denied the right to marry.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003ca href=\"https://scholar.google.com/scholar_case?case=1984506746130471324&q=Perry+vs.+Schwarzenegger&hl=en&as_sdt=2006\">Judge Walker's decision in August 2010\u003c/a> struck down \u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Proposition\u003c/span> 8 on the basis that it violated the due process and equal protection clauses of the 14th Amendment, saying California had no rational interest in denying marriage licenses to gay and lesbian couples. The decision was later upheld in a 2-1 decision by the Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals. In 2013, the Supreme Court declined to take up the case, ruling narrowly that \u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Proposition \u003c/span>8 supporters lacked legal standing to appeal the lower court decisions, which opened the way for same-sex marriages to resume in California after a five-year hiatus.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Hollingsworth v. Perry et al was one of dozens of cases \"denied certiorari\" or denied review by the court today.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>When asked before Tuesday's decision when the trial tapes would be made available, a spokesperson for the courts said \"we will work with the judge in the underlying case to make them available promptly. They'll be posted on a publicly available site.\" No additional details were given.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad floatright]\u003c/p>\n","blocks":[],"excerpt":"Tuesday's decision is the culmination of a 12-year legal effort that began in 2009 when a media coalition led by KQED sought to have the Proposition 8 trial broadcast.","status":"publish","parent":0,"modified":1665516446,"stats":{"hasAudio":false,"hasVideo":false,"hasChartOrMap":false,"iframeSrcs":[],"hasGoogleForm":false,"hasGallery":false,"hasHearkenModule":false,"hasPolis":false,"paragraphCount":27,"wordCount":1285},"headData":{"title":"Supreme Court Clears Way for Release of Footage From Landmark Trial That Legalized Same-Sex Marriage in California | KQED","description":"Tuesday's decision is the culmination of a 12-year legal effort that began in 2009 when a media coalition led by KQED sought to have the Proposition 8 trial broadcast.","ogTitle":"","ogDescription":"","ogImgId":"","twTitle":"","twDescription":"","twImgId":"","schema":{"@context":"http://schema.org","@type":"NewsArticle","headline":"Supreme Court Clears Way for Release of Footage From Landmark Trial That Legalized Same-Sex Marriage in California","datePublished":"2022-10-11T13:47:15.000Z","dateModified":"2022-10-11T19:27:26.000Z","image":"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/KQED-OG-Image@1x.png","isAccessibleForFree":"Y","publisher":{"@type":"NewsMediaOrganization","@id":"https://www.kqed.org/#organization","name":"KQED","url":"https://www.kqed.org","logo":"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/KQED-OG-Image@1x.png"}}},"disqusIdentifier":"11911275 https://ww2.kqed.org/news/?p=11911275","disqusUrl":"https://ww2.kqed.org/news/2022/10/11/supreme-court-ruling-clears-way-for-release-of-footage-from-landmark-trial-that-legalized-same-sex-marriage-in-california/","disqusTitle":"Supreme Court Clears Way for Release of Footage From Landmark Trial That Legalized Same-Sex Marriage in California","excludeFromSiteSearch":"Include","path":"/news/11911275/supreme-court-ruling-clears-way-for-release-of-footage-from-landmark-trial-that-legalized-same-sex-marriage-in-california","audioTrackLength":null,"parsedContent":[{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003cp>KQED scored a historic legal victory Tuesday when the U.S. Supreme Court declined to consider an effort to block the release of videotapes from the 2010 federal trial in San Francisco that ultimately led to the legalization of same-sex marriage in California.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Tuesday's decision is the culmination of a 12-year legal effort that began in 2009 when a media coalition led by KQED sought to have the trial broadcast. In 2017 KQED asked the Northern District of California to unseal the trial tapes, arguing that the recordings were a vital part of the public record in a historic legal case. While the court did not agree to immediately release the tapes, it ordered them to be unsealed on Aug. 12, 2020 — 10 years after the case closed. In declining to hear an appeal of lower court rulings, the Supreme Court effectively cleared the way for the tapes to be released.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“After today’s ruling by the U.S. Supreme Court, the public will finally be able to watch the testimony that Judge Vaughn Walker considered in deciding that same-sex couples have the right to marry,\" said Thomas R. Burke, KQED's attorney. \"There’s no doubt that the video will become a valuable instrument to educate the public about this historic moment.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\"Great news! Love wins again and now, so does transparency,\" said Jeff Zarillo, one of the original plaintiffs in the case.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Holly Kernan, KQED's chief content officer, agreed. \"If our systems work behind closed doors, with no press or public access, we have no idea how decisions are made, nor what arguments are leading to these decisions,\" she said. \"KQED wants more sunlight on our legal system and we will fight on behalf of the public to get that access.\" \u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"aside","attributes":{"named":{"postid":"news_11919970,news_11922040","label":"Related Posts "},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>Supporters of Proposition 8 – a California ballot proposition passed by voters in 2008 that would have banned same-sex marriage in the state – previously appealed to the 9th Circuit Court of Appeals, seeking to have the tapes sealed permanently.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>That court dismissed that request, saying the petitioners lacked legal standing for their appeal. The court also batted away the contention that unsealing the tapes would lead to harm or harassment of anyone directly involved in the trial and confirmed the lower court’s decision to unseal the tapes.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>In a last-ditch effort to keep the tapes sealed, Proposition 8 proponents asked the Supreme Court to take up the case. In their \u003ca href=\"https://www.supremecourt.gov/DocketPDF/21/21-1304/219553/20220328101818830_Hollingsworth%20v.%20Perry%20Petition.pdf\">March 28, 2022 petition\u003c/a>, attorneys for Proposition 8 said the court's intervention was needed to \"prevent a grievous injury\" to the ballot measure's backers and to \"the integrity of the federal judiciary.\"\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>This entire issue began over 12 years ago, when Judge Vaughn R. Walker, the federal court judge who presided over the 2010 Perry v. Schwarzenegger trial, announced that he wanted the entire proceeding to be broadcast live via closed-circuit television with viewing in federal courthouses in San Francisco, Pasadena, Seattle and Portland, Oregon.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>That would have made Perry v. Schwarzenegger the first federal trial to be broadcast and recorded, with videotapes to be made available for later viewing on YouTube.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>But the Proposition 8 defense team objected as the bench trial was starting and the Supreme Court intervened, stopping the live broadcast before it began. The court said Walker failed to go through the appropriate process for getting approval for such a broadcast.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Over objections from Proposition 8 attorneys, Walker said he would videotape the trial anyway for personal use in his chambers to help him write the decision, which ultimately struck down Proposition 8.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Responding to the Supreme Court's refusal to take up the case and allow the lower court rulings to stand, Walker, who is now retired from the bench, said the justices did the right thing.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\"With everything else going on in the world, not weighing in on this issue was an easy decision,\" said Walker. He added that the format of the Prop. 8 trial, with its expert witnesses providing testimony about the history, economics, sociology and psychology of gender roles and same-sex marriage could be a blueprint for judges in other controversial issues, including abortion.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\"It was testimony by people who understood the whole panoply which gender plays in our society and in personal relationships,\" Walker said. \"Trials reveal things that simply cannot come out when you're scratching through old dusty books and records of the long past. And I think there are going to be many enactments affecting the abortion rights in the various states in the wake of the Dobbs decision.\"\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"ad","attributes":{"named":{"label":"fullwidth"},"numeric":["fullwidth"]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>In seeking to block release of the videotapes, attorneys for the ballot measure's proponents argued to the Supreme Court that Walker \"solemnly promised\" in court that the tapes would not be made public, and that doing so now would undermine public faith in the courts.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>In a \u003ca href=\"https://www.supremecourt.gov/DocketPDF/21/21-1304/226576/20220531111532780_Hollingsworth%20v.%20Perry%20--%20Brief%20in%20Opp.pdf\">response brief (PDF)\u003c/a>, attorneys for KQED argued that there was never a promise to keep the trial tapes sealed beyond 10 years and that Proposition 8 supporters failed to demonstrate any concrete injury that would come from releasing them.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Kris Perry, one of the original plaintiffs along with her partner Sandy Stier, said release of the tapes was long overdue.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\"Since the 2010 ruling striking down Proposition 8, we have fought to have the video record of our historic trial shared with the public,\" Perry said. \"There is no more important time to expose the discriminatory rhetoric of proponents and the courage of the experts, attorneys and plaintiffs in standing up against hate. Even though it's been 12 years since our ruling, we know the fight for marriage equality and many other basic civil rights is still essential and this video shows the evidence for why.\"\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The 2009 lawsuit filed by supporters of same-sex marriage against Proposition 8 was considered risky by some progressive legal groups, which worried that a setback in federal court could take decades to undo.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The trial gained national attention, in part because the legal team seeking to have Proposition 8 struck down was led by conservative Theodore Olson and liberal David Boies, who were on \u003cem>opposite\u003c/em> sides of the infamous Bush v. Gore case following the disputed 2000 presidential election.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The three-week trial in 2010 considered a wide range of issues, including the history of marriage, the political power of the LGBTQ+ community, the social and psychological harm of so-called \"conversion therapy\" and how the plaintiffs and their children were personally affected by being denied the right to marry.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003ca href=\"https://scholar.google.com/scholar_case?case=1984506746130471324&q=Perry+vs.+Schwarzenegger&hl=en&as_sdt=2006\">Judge Walker's decision in August 2010\u003c/a> struck down \u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Proposition\u003c/span> 8 on the basis that it violated the due process and equal protection clauses of the 14th Amendment, saying California had no rational interest in denying marriage licenses to gay and lesbian couples. The decision was later upheld in a 2-1 decision by the Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals. In 2013, the Supreme Court declined to take up the case, ruling narrowly that \u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Proposition \u003c/span>8 supporters lacked legal standing to appeal the lower court decisions, which opened the way for same-sex marriages to resume in California after a five-year hiatus.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Hollingsworth v. Perry et al was one of dozens of cases \"denied certiorari\" or denied review by the court today.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>When asked before Tuesday's decision when the trial tapes would be made available, a spokesperson for the courts said \"we will work with the judge in the underlying case to make them available promptly. They'll be posted on a publicly available site.\" No additional details were given.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"ad","attributes":{"named":{"label":"floatright"},"numeric":["floatright"]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003c/div>\u003c/p>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}}],"link":"/news/11911275/supreme-court-ruling-clears-way-for-release-of-footage-from-landmark-trial-that-legalized-same-sex-marriage-in-california","authors":["255"],"categories":["news_6188","news_8","news_13"],"tags":["news_27626","news_323","news_126","news_322","news_1244"],"featImg":"news_11926613","label":"news"},"news_11828252":{"type":"posts","id":"news_11828252","meta":{"index":"posts_1591205157","site":"news","id":"11828252","score":null,"sort":[1594369825000]},"guestAuthors":[],"slug":"judge-unseals-videotapes-of-historic-same-sex-marriage-trial","title":"Judge Unseals Videotapes of Historic Same-Sex Marriage Trial","publishDate":1594369825,"format":"standard","headTitle":"KQED News","labelTerm":{},"content":"\u003cp>Nearly a decade after a federal judge in San Francisco struck down Proposition 8, the ballot measure banning same-sex marriage in California, videotapes of the trial may finally be available, despite the objections of Prop. 8 supporters.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Federal District Court Judge William Orrick Thursday rejected a motion by Prop. 8 proponents to permanently seal the videotapes, saying the motion contained \"no justification, much less a compelling one, to keep the trial recordings under seal any longer.\" He ordered the recordings to become public next month.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\"It's incredibly important to have it be open, not only for the historical record, but so the people can see this particular trial video,\" said Thomas R. Burke the attorney representing KQED. \"It's one of the only federal trial videos of its kind ever in the United States,\" he said. [pullquote size=\"medium\" align=\"right\" citation=\"Thomas R. Burke, lawyer on behalf of KQED\"]'It begs the question: What are they trying to hide? Because if they had legitimate concerns about risks to witnesses, they could have put in a declaration.'[/pullquote]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Burke added that it would be unusual for a judge to permanently prevent the public from getting access to a trial that was open to the public in the first place.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\"That is a rare circumstance. But it's particularly troubling in this case where what is being sealed is a record of an admitted historic trial that ultimately allowed in and found in favor of same-sex marriage,\" Burke said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>KQED's Chief Content Officer Holly Kernan said it is a \"victory for transparency and accountability.\"\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>As the trial began in 2010, District Court Judge Vaughn Walker announced he would allow courtroom cameras to both videotape the proceedings and make the images available in real time to those who wanted to see the trial on a closed circuit system in federal courthouses around the country.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad fullwidth]Prop. 8 proponents objected, and ultimately the U.S. Supreme Court intervened to block televising the trial. Despite the objections of attorneys on behalf of Prop. 8, Judge Walker continued recording the trial, promising that he would only use them privately to help in writing his opinion after the trial.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The current case has had a lengthy history. Over ten years ago, in 2008 California voters passed Prop. 8 by 52-48%. After the California Supreme Court upheld the measure, opponents sued in federal court, which led to the trial presided over by Judge Walker. In 2010, Walker struck down the law saying it violated the Due Process and Equal Protection clauses of the 14th Amendment to the U.S. Constitution. In 2013 the U.S. Supreme Court let Walker's decision stand, allowing same-sex marriages to resume in California.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>In 2017, KQED, supported by other media organizations including the New York Times, AP and CNN, submitted a motion to have the tapes made available to the public. The following year, in 2018, Judge Orrick said that \"compelling justification of judicial integrity\" outweighed the public's right to see the tapes at that time. He based that on Judge Walker's promise to keep the tapes private. But he never suggested they should be sealed indefinitely.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Attorneys for Prop. 8 claimed releasing the tapes at any point would risk harm to witnesses who testified their opposition to same-sex marriage. However, as Judge Orrick noted, they \"did not submit evidence\" to support that claim which justified sealing the tapes forever. [aside tag=\"lgbt, proposition 8\" label=\"More Related Stories\"]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\"We are deeply disappointed by Judge Orrick’s ruling that 'the compelling justification of judicial integrity' no longer requires the court to honor Judge Walker’s solemn, on the record, commitment that the video tapes of the trial would be used solely for his own in-chambers purposes in rendering his judgment in the case,\" said attorney John Ohlendorf in an email. \"We do not agree that there is a ten-year statute of limitations on judicial integrity, and we are preparing our appeal.\"\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>However attorney Thomas Burke said it's never been clear to him why the measure's proponents felt so strongly about preventing the public from seeing the tapes.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\"It begs the question: What are they trying to hide? Because if they had legitimate concerns about risks to witnesses, they could have put in a declaration. They've never done that,\" Burke said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Burke says it's past time to allow the public to see the trial which led to the historic decision.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\"The trial's over. No more witnesses are happening. The law has been changed,\" Burke said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Unless a higher court intervenes, the videotapes will be made public August 12, 2020.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[documentcloud url=\"https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/6986060-2020-07-09-909-Order-Denying-892-Motion-to.html\" responsive=true text=false]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>Note: At the request of KQED's attorney, the author submitted a declaration to the court describing potential editorial uses of the videotapes if they were released.\u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n","blocks":[],"excerpt":"A decade after Proposition 8 was struck down, the public may soon be able to see videotapes of the federal trial.","status":"publish","parent":0,"modified":1594419254,"stats":{"hasAudio":false,"hasVideo":false,"hasChartOrMap":false,"iframeSrcs":[],"hasGoogleForm":false,"hasGallery":false,"hasHearkenModule":false,"hasPolis":false,"paragraphCount":20,"wordCount":836},"headData":{"title":"Judge Unseals Videotapes of Historic Same-Sex Marriage Trial | KQED","description":"A decade after Proposition 8 was struck down, the public may soon be able to see videotapes of the federal trial.","ogTitle":"","ogDescription":"","ogImgId":"","twTitle":"","twDescription":"","twImgId":"","schema":{"@context":"http://schema.org","@type":"NewsArticle","headline":"Judge Unseals Videotapes of Historic Same-Sex Marriage Trial","datePublished":"2020-07-10T08:30:25.000Z","dateModified":"2020-07-10T22:14:14.000Z","image":"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/KQED-OG-Image@1x.png","isAccessibleForFree":"Y","publisher":{"@type":"NewsMediaOrganization","@id":"https://www.kqed.org/#organization","name":"KQED","url":"https://www.kqed.org","logo":"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/KQED-OG-Image@1x.png"}}},"disqusIdentifier":"11828252 https://ww2.kqed.org/news/?p=11828252","disqusUrl":"https://ww2.kqed.org/news/2020/07/10/judge-unseals-videotapes-of-historic-same-sex-marriage-trial/","disqusTitle":"Judge Unseals Videotapes of Historic Same-Sex Marriage Trial","source":"News","sourceUrl":"http://kqed.org/","path":"/news/11828252/judge-unseals-videotapes-of-historic-same-sex-marriage-trial","audioTrackLength":null,"parsedContent":[{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003cp>Nearly a decade after a federal judge in San Francisco struck down Proposition 8, the ballot measure banning same-sex marriage in California, videotapes of the trial may finally be available, despite the objections of Prop. 8 supporters.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Federal District Court Judge William Orrick Thursday rejected a motion by Prop. 8 proponents to permanently seal the videotapes, saying the motion contained \"no justification, much less a compelling one, to keep the trial recordings under seal any longer.\" He ordered the recordings to become public next month.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\"It's incredibly important to have it be open, not only for the historical record, but so the people can see this particular trial video,\" said Thomas R. Burke the attorney representing KQED. \"It's one of the only federal trial videos of its kind ever in the United States,\" he said. \u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"'It begs the question: What are they trying to hide? Because if they had legitimate concerns about risks to witnesses, they could have put in a declaration.'","name":"pullquote","attributes":{"named":{"size":"medium","align":"right","citation":"Thomas R. Burke, lawyer on behalf of KQED","label":""},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Burke added that it would be unusual for a judge to permanently prevent the public from getting access to a trial that was open to the public in the first place.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\"That is a rare circumstance. But it's particularly troubling in this case where what is being sealed is a record of an admitted historic trial that ultimately allowed in and found in favor of same-sex marriage,\" Burke said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>KQED's Chief Content Officer Holly Kernan said it is a \"victory for transparency and accountability.\"\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>As the trial began in 2010, District Court Judge Vaughn Walker announced he would allow courtroom cameras to both videotape the proceedings and make the images available in real time to those who wanted to see the trial on a closed circuit system in federal courthouses around the country.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"ad","attributes":{"named":{"label":"fullwidth"},"numeric":["fullwidth"]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>Prop. 8 proponents objected, and ultimately the U.S. Supreme Court intervened to block televising the trial. Despite the objections of attorneys on behalf of Prop. 8, Judge Walker continued recording the trial, promising that he would only use them privately to help in writing his opinion after the trial.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The current case has had a lengthy history. Over ten years ago, in 2008 California voters passed Prop. 8 by 52-48%. After the California Supreme Court upheld the measure, opponents sued in federal court, which led to the trial presided over by Judge Walker. In 2010, Walker struck down the law saying it violated the Due Process and Equal Protection clauses of the 14th Amendment to the U.S. Constitution. In 2013 the U.S. Supreme Court let Walker's decision stand, allowing same-sex marriages to resume in California.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>In 2017, KQED, supported by other media organizations including the New York Times, AP and CNN, submitted a motion to have the tapes made available to the public. The following year, in 2018, Judge Orrick said that \"compelling justification of judicial integrity\" outweighed the public's right to see the tapes at that time. He based that on Judge Walker's promise to keep the tapes private. But he never suggested they should be sealed indefinitely.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Attorneys for Prop. 8 claimed releasing the tapes at any point would risk harm to witnesses who testified their opposition to same-sex marriage. However, as Judge Orrick noted, they \"did not submit evidence\" to support that claim which justified sealing the tapes forever. \u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"aside","attributes":{"named":{"tag":"lgbt, proposition 8","label":"More Related Stories "},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\"We are deeply disappointed by Judge Orrick’s ruling that 'the compelling justification of judicial integrity' no longer requires the court to honor Judge Walker’s solemn, on the record, commitment that the video tapes of the trial would be used solely for his own in-chambers purposes in rendering his judgment in the case,\" said attorney John Ohlendorf in an email. \"We do not agree that there is a ten-year statute of limitations on judicial integrity, and we are preparing our appeal.\"\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>However attorney Thomas Burke said it's never been clear to him why the measure's proponents felt so strongly about preventing the public from seeing the tapes.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\"It begs the question: What are they trying to hide? Because if they had legitimate concerns about risks to witnesses, they could have put in a declaration. They've never done that,\" Burke said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Burke says it's past time to allow the public to see the trial which led to the historic decision.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\"The trial's over. No more witnesses are happening. The law has been changed,\" Burke said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Unless a higher court intervenes, the videotapes will be made public August 12, 2020.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"documentcloud","attributes":{"named":{"url":"https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/6986060-2020-07-09-909-Order-Denying-892-Motion-to.html","responsive":"true","text":"false","label":""},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>Note: At the request of KQED's attorney, the author submitted a declaration to the court describing potential editorial uses of the videotapes if they were released.\u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003c/div>\u003c/p>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}}],"link":"/news/11828252/judge-unseals-videotapes-of-historic-same-sex-marriage-trial","authors":["255"],"categories":["news_6188","news_8","news_13"],"tags":["news_82","news_17968","news_126","news_322"],"featImg":"news_68606","label":"source_news_11828252"}},"programsReducer":{"possible":{"id":"possible","title":"Possible","info":"Possible is hosted by entrepreneur Reid Hoffman and writer Aria Finger. 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You can also visit the MindShift website for episodes and supplemental blog posts or tweet us \u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/MindShiftKQED\">@MindShiftKQED\u003c/a> or visit us at \u003ca href=\"/mindshift\">MindShift.KQED.org\u003c/a>","imageSrc":"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2024/04/Mindshift-Podcast-Tile-703x703-1.jpg","imageAlt":"KQED MindShift: How We Will Learn","officialWebsiteLink":"/mindshift/","meta":{"site":"news","source":"kqed","order":"2"},"link":"/podcasts/mindshift","subscribe":{"apple":"https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/mindshift-podcast/id1078765985","google":"https://podcasts.google.com/feed/aHR0cHM6Ly9mZWVkcy5tZWdhcGhvbmUuZm0vS1FJTkM1NzY0NjAwNDI5","npr":"https://www.npr.org/podcasts/464615685/mind-shift-podcast","stitcher":"https://www.stitcher.com/podcast/kqed/stories-teachers-share","spotify":"https://open.spotify.com/show/0MxSpNYZKNprFLCl7eEtyx"}},"morning-edition":{"id":"morning-edition","title":"Morning Edition","info":"\u003cem>Morning Edition\u003c/em> takes listeners around the country and the world with multi-faceted stories and commentaries every weekday. 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